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If you’re working at your marriage you’re doing something wrong?? I think that is the most backwards thinking I have ever heard. Although Im too young to be married, having seen my parents marriage fail, I know you must work at (some, not all) marriages to keep them strong. Putting work & effort into a marriage shows how much you love and value your relationship with your spouse, and that you care about the commitment you made, instead of just throwing your hands in the air and saying “oh guess that didn’t work out” without trying at all! mackay11 wrote:I have a friend who had the dream of becoming a doctor. She married at 21 but decided to get through medical school and the first few years of being qualified before having kids. The old ladies and church would often ask her ‘any kids yet?’ To which she’d sweetly smile and reply ‘no, but we’re having fun practising.’ That would usually shut the old dears up for a while. They now have two beautiful kids.
Hahaha love it!!Katzpur wrote:Blue-bird, let me begin by saying I know exactly how you feel. I really, really do. I am a 64-year-old LDS woman (born and raised in the Church). As a teenager, I absolutely hated babysitting, simply because I just didn’t like kids. Growing up, I remember telling my mother that I never wanted to have children.
Thank you so much for sharing (: That’s exactly how I feel. Glad Im not the only Mormon girl who feels this way.vickzorz wrote:Gah that sounds so infuriating…. I got angry when I heard the same type of comments in YW too. I think this image just sums it up though:
http://feministmormonhousewives.tumblr.com/post/41145584070/i-belong-to-the-church-of-jesus-christ-of
Perfect. (:hawkgrrrl wrote:Motherhood being praised is deceptive. This is something called Romantic Paternalism, when a man restricts a woman’s choices by telling her how great she is. She’s too special, precious, important to be out in the world. He needs to protect her. Putting a woman on a pedestal is one way to shackle her. Also, bear in mind how many times you hear that men need the priesthood whereas women don’t because they are inherently more spiritual. Nice try, but it’s Romantic Paternalism again.
Quote:my leaders then proceeded to explain how it’s not a woman’s “place” to have a career, but it is the man’s job. And the woman’s job is to have children and stay home.
What if the man loses his job? What if he cheats on you and leaves you? What if he is critically injured or killed? Try taking this empty promise to the bank. And besides that, this is essentially an economic model for marriage which is very outdated today. Most people have what it called a Hedonic marriage – marrying for love and companionship. In the old economic model, 1/2 + 1/2 = 1. But I don’t believe that people are a half of a whole. People should be whole people in their own right, not requiring marriage to “complete” them. In the economic model, the couple is financially successful because the wife runs all the domestic aspects of life supporting and cheering on the husband as he meets the financial obligations. But heaven help the couple that divorces or loses one of the two spouses because the whole thing collapses.
But – and I should follow my own advice on this one – don’t get mad. Ignore stupidity, and it will be much easier for you throughout life, both in the church, in college, and in your career. Probably in your marriage too.
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Wow.. I understand now why people love your posts so much!! Thank you for your input, I really appreciate your perspective! (:[quote=”mom3″I add my agreement to everyone else’s – this is your life, your road – and it is between you and God how you walk it. You’re very okay.[/quote] Thank you for your story & encouraging comments (:
Martha wrote:On the main page of this site is a great article that may help you differentiate what is from God and what is just opinion or culture.
Thank you!! (:wuwei wrote:I’ve found many that get upset when we buck a tradition are those who’ve bought in the hardest, regret it, and are jealous you have the spine to exercise your agency unlike they did.
I agree! Congrats on your baby!! So exciting!! (:Roy wrote:
Is it fair to say that we have enshrined the idea that men and women are not complete without each other in our theology? Might it be extra hard to eliminate these notions from the church because we understand these things as the way God intended it to be? Is this part of why singles, divorced persons, gays, career women, and anyone else that doesn’t fit well into the traditional gender role of marriage tend to feel out of place like they don’t fully belong?
I think you’re exactly right. My mother is divorced and struggles with the feeling of “not belonging” or not fitting quite right into the cookie-cutter Mormon mold.I feel for you, I really do. Several members in my family have been diagnosed with depression & sometimes I feel I have inherited it as well, so I have at least a tiny hint of understanding of what you are going through. I pray things get better for you. Its a tough spot you’re in right now.
Wow, what an interesting story. Wherever your path leads, I hope you find balance & where you belong. My life is a balancing act right now at the moment as well. As for the strong pull back to the church, like several people have said, I try to act on them. Best of luck.
Ann wrote:Nothing can separate us from the love of God. . . .unless we let it.
I really like that, thank you! (:
On Own Now wrote:blue_bird,
I want to be completely honest here, but please don’t take this the wrong way; I am merely expressing my own angst about this situation… I’ve started a couple of replies to you and not finished them, because of the uniqueness of your situation. So here it is… I must admit that I feel sheepish about even addressing you on these forums because you are someone else’s child and no matter how nice and wise and caring we might all seem, nobody cares about you like your own family. It’s not really our place to give you advice or counsel outside of earshot of your parents.
So, I would encourage you to seek out the best aspects of the church and try to make them a part of who you are… not a checkbox item from someone else’s list, but something about you. Easy experiment: think of going to church not as a requirement to enter the Celestial Kingdom, or as a Pharisaical devotion, but think of it as an opportunity to worship Jesus, the Messiah, the Great Teacher, who gave his life to offer a “new life” to all of us.
I completely understand your point on my family, my mom knows I’m on this site and is in full support. I really appreciate your advice on internalizing aspects of the gospel, Ive never considered church from that standpoint before and Ill be sure to give it a try this Sunday (:
Orson wrote:
Remember this much:God is in the
truth, NOT the expectations. Nobody’s words are as important as your own listening to the Spirit of truth and love. Wow, that was very enlightening. I”m very much a people-pleaser. I’ve got to learn to put God’s opinion before peoples.
hawkgrrrl wrote:blue_bird –
One caution I will give you is that everything you read or are told, in the church or outside the church, absolutely everything is written from a biased perspective. Whoever wrote it or said it had a point of view and a point to make. There’s no such thing as objective history or objectivity about human emotions.
Interesting..Never thought if it like that before.
hawkgrrrl wrote:Ha, you and I went through the same thing as laurels! I think they are going to have to quit teaching the D&C year in seminary or else offer free lobotomies beforehand. That was an early hallmark of my own faith crisis, and like you, I raised the concern that I couldn’t accept this idea, and I was assured by a well-meaning female seminary teacher that I had no choice and it was going to happen in the eternities whether I liked it or not.
The church contains the gospel, but it also contains a bunch of crap brought in by humans. We have to figure out how to sort this out and embrace what is good and let go of what is not.
Don’t do what I did at your age. I became depressed and felt there was no place for me in the church. There is! You just have to make your own way and not care about what others think of you because the approval of other church members is not worth the cost to your authenticity.
I’m so glad that I am not the only one freaked out by the polygamy idea. I really appreciate your insight; much of what you said is exactly how I feel. I feel as if there is no place for me in the church; no room for “middle ground” & moderation. It’s either all or nothing. Thank you very, very much for shedding some light on this issue.
cwald wrote:I will accept being a heretic and an apostate and spending eternity in the terrestrial kingdom, before I accept dc 132 as inspired by god and a commandment.
It doesn’t work for me at any level…the way it was taught and practiced by JS and especially BY.
I totally agree. Good to know I’m not the only one who feels this way!
Orson wrote:
3) I as well as others have our own modern revelation about polygamy in the eternities. I suggest you seek out your own as well.I will seek out my own revelation, thank you. (:
Old-Timer wrote:Get used to me linking to previous posts about the same topics, since I think it good to know what has been said in the past here:
Thank you!
Ahh, do you know how refreshing it is do hear people sharing my same opinion about the whole white shirt rule? 
blue_birdWow, Germany? Thats a really interesting place to go on a mission. The YM from my ward keep getting called to un-exotic places like California & Kansas. (: blue_birdRoadrunner wrote:I don’t know how much of it was me, how much was my parents, and how much was the church, but it took me a long time to figure out that perfection is unknowable and that constant guilt is counter productive.
Very interesting that you mentioned feeling guilty, for this is something I have struggled with for a while now. I feel like sometimes the Church’s push for perfection is over-kill for some people who already put high demands and expectations on themselves. I think it can be, in my case at least, very self-destructive and undermines the good we do, and prevents us from seeing it.
Old-Timer wrote:Also, I’ve known I think differently than others since at least age 7. In many ways, recognizing this early was a great blessing for me. It can be for you, if you can see it that way.
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I’ve always known I have more “liberal” views towards church doctrine / culture than most, and unfortunately I feel that this is “middle of the road” type thinking is not accepted. You’re either “all in” or “the ward project”, as I currently am.
