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I just don’t think the average TBM type can comprehend that someone really believes the church is false. It has to be sin or laziness of some kind. It just does not enter their mind that the church is wrong it must be the individual.
If you have that viewpoint your brain has to develop reasons for people leaving.
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Old Timer wrote:Their approach works for a whole lot of people – far more than would be represented at a site like this, since most people here are here because their approach doesn’t work exactly for us, even it their approach helps many people here as evidence that more people are walking individual paths than is apparent locally on Sunday.
They do an important work, even if it is different than our work.
I am not sure the average member even knows who these people are and the positions they take.
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I find indifference to church leaders allows me to appreciate their good qualities and ignore what I do not like. I realize in the end the have no power over me
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These guys run around getting interviewed and writing books. I wonder if they would feel the same if they were Joe Nobody. Their identity now seems to be caught up in this non crisis faith crisis. Personally I am not sure they are doing any service to anyone. Maybe 5% of people learning the reality of the church can ignore the problems The rest of us have to face the facts and make hard decisions. Their approach is just not an option and gives ammo to those claiming you can have doubts and believe.
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Mostly just boring. It’s like you hear the same thing over and over. Canned questions and canned answers Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Maybe he has only so many resources so he has to ration out what he can do. Maybe there is some kind of cosmic criteria for getting a miracle. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Take a 12 month sabbatical from all church callings. At the end of that you will have a pretty good idea which path is more fulfilling Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Bear wrote:Thanks to all of you:) it’s really nice to read your comments/thoughts. Thanks! I’m also contemplating not paying tithing at all. Just because I feel so isolated in church. No one seems to understand where I’m coming from. And giving lessons keeps getting harder because I’m slowly acknowledging how I truly feel about many church topics. And I just don’t agree on too much anymore.
Thanks everyone. I’ll get back to you and write more later.
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And that is the best solution. I stopped paying tithing some time ago and financially have never been better. Only because I had more disposable income. Statistically speaking there are not financial blessing associated with paying tithing. All the anecdotal stories you hear are just that stories.
Think of it this way. Taking God out of the equation, what would that money mean to you, and what would it mean to the church as a whole?
Now if you want to pay tithing because you like the church and want to support it I think that is fine. We should pay our way as much as possible. But if that house is important to you then by all means do what you need to to move in to it. At some point in the future it if you feel the ned you can always pay tithing again.
Sounds like God tends to be dramatic like most humans do when making a point Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The human brain is a marvelous creation. It would not be out of bounds to propose that your brain is constantly working analyzing and planning to keep you safe as possible. So perhaps there is an outside force or a billion years of evolution. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
SilentDawning wrote:Cadence wrote:Yawn. I think JH is just expressing his annoyance at those who leave. I just choose not to pay attention to him when he rants. Or really at any time.
I’m always disciplining myself NOT to write off what the leaders say entirely, even when they have weak moments like JRH did. But I don’t hang on their words either, and I’m perfectly willing to accept their advice if it makes sense — and perfectly willing to write it off as ridiculous if my conscience says so.
I think that is true of any person in some kind of leadership. If we develop an opinion of someone that they never have a good thing to say we may miss when they actually say something. Of course the real trick is to learn when it is pure BS.
Yawn. I think JH is just expressing his annoyance at those who leave. I just choose not to pay attention to him when he rants. Or really at any time. If you think about it here is a guy who has spent his entire life devoted to the church. It is not possible in his mind that it is not all good. Even if he has some questions, he believes the scope and majesty of the church is so powerful as to override any trivial issues someone may have. I have more sympathy for him than anger.
Once I came to the conclusion the church was a collection of fictional accounts and the ideas of men thrown together it all made sense. For me it is as easy as that. There is no analysis necessary. So I never really read the CES letter other than hitting the high points because I already had the answers to all the questions posed.
Am I correct in my conclusions. I think so, but would never claim there is no possible other explanation. If someone actually answered the questions in some satisfactory way I would love to listen, but I am not holding my breath.
Assuming you wonder why god allows all the crappy stuff to happen, I think there are three possible reasons. 1. He does not exist
2. He is unable or powerless to take action
3. He chooses not to for some reason.
Number one is atheism. If you can not stomach that you probably need to go with three. Number two is a god that is rather useless. At least three gives the hope of some kind of rhyme and reason to it all.
If you reject all of those and believe god does intervene and talk to prophets, I say he is rather inept and arbitrary.
