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I only wish we could see something like that in my stake. I am in Northern California in a rather conservative area. Our ward has shrunk to have average attendance around 100-110. Many Sundays I count about 75-80 people. Our YW program has 6 girls in it. There are probably 5 YM total. There are a few other wards in the stake that are very large, bursting at the seams with nowhere to sit. I attended my son’s ward last week and the youth leaders told of having 24 youth at the recent temple baptisms. And that is the number that attended–I’m sure there are more that didn’t attend. I find this to be a difficult problem. I have a 15 year old who dislikes church mostly because there is no one there she considers a friend. She has nothing in common with the other girls and with such a small group it is unlikely she will find someone. I have asked for years why they don’t realign the boundaries. The answer I was given by the Stake ES was that “it’s a lot of work”. It was pointless to share my philosophy that things worth having are generally a lot of work to get. Try convincing your teenager to go to the activity night when there may be one other girl there and maybe 2 boys. Wards and stakes should be realigned as the population shifts. In fact it seems that a review at least every 5-10 years would be appropriate. There really is no reason to have such an imbalance in the membership boundaries because it puts a stress on everyone–especially the small ward where it is difficult to find members to fill callings. In my ward it is also leading to losing our youth. If they don’t have good friends that are LDS they are less inclined to attend those “uplifting activities” that are planned for them like youth conference and even the monthly dances. If we are going to enforce the geographic rule of where we can attend church, the leadership should do their best to make sure each ward and ward member have similar opportunities. (I am aware that small wards can be a blessing, but tell that to a teenager. In fact our Bishop at ward conference gave a talk on the subject of not complaining about being in a small ward. Seriously.) The letter was read in my ward today. Every member of the bishopric was out of town so the HPGL was conducting. There were a total of 75 people in attendance today. (Yes, I counted.) The letter was read in a combined opening exercises of RS and PH where the youth were invited to sit in. The opening song, prayer and announcements were given. The letter was read by the HPGL. At the conclusion of the letter he stated that should anyone have questions they should contact the ES to make an appointment to speak with the Bishop when we returned from vacation. Everyone is dismissed to their classes. That’s it. My son’s ward in the same Stake had the letter read and then a question and answer session. I guess one of the members asked what the ramifications were for them to agree with the Courts. They were told that they could basically agree with the Courts but really shouldn’t talk about it with others. My daughter’s ward in TX hasn’t addressed it yet. Next week it’s on their schedule. This will definitely be leadership roulette. I am not even sure why they need to read the letter that simply restates what they have said for years. One of the more offensive parts to me is that no reception or celebration for a same sex marriage can be held on church premises. These members pay their tithing and devote their hours of service to the Lord but don’t ask to have a party here. We reserve that for the family reunions, wedding receptions and birthday celebrations of our members in good standing.
Slowly, I feel the same. I have recently been wearing them a little less. Maybe just the top or the bottom, depending on how obvious it is. I feel so much cooler without them, and much more free. In fact my clothes fit better. But my husband has no idea and I don’t intend to tell him. I just change my clothes when he is not in the room. I don’t even feel guilty about it, and that is huge for me. They have lost their magic to me, just a bit. I remember the first time they were put on my body in the temple, it was as though something that had been missing all my life was now there. It was strangely comforting. I wish they still gave me that comfort but they don’t. They have become mortal, if that makes sense. I have waited a while to respond and explain any more about my husband and his testimony, mostly because I found the comments of OON hurtful and I was offended. I understand no offense was intended, but I was hurt anyway. He is right that I came to vent, and I felt he basically told me to deal with it privately with my husband. I get it, but I cannot do that at this time. My husband doesn’t discuss these things with me, and his testimony was, or at least it seemed, a direct response to a conversation we had had earlier. I told him that I didn’t believe that EVERY leader ALWAYS speaks for God. I expressed my belief that plenty of leaders have their own opinion, and that members have the right and obligation to prayerfully go to The Lord and ask if a particular leader’s advice or counsel is of God. We didn’t discuss this very long, because my husband made it clear he disagreed. The next Sunday was TM, and that was his very public testimony. I felt it was a very personal “in your face” testimony. My husband has never made those sorts of comments in a testimony before, and he testifies regularly at church. And it is usually something very similar month in and month out. This was completely different, and it felt personal. It hurt. I feel like this a place to be able to vent, because where else can we go? As we vent and receive understanding,love, and advice, it can be very helpful. After this post I just felt embarrassed I had even said anything. I realize that was not the intent, but it made me step back and ask if this was a place I needed to be. Again, I know there was no offense intended, and the fact that it was taken is on me. But, I can assure you that my husband will never really “respect” my new faith. He simply doesn’t want to discuss it so that we won’t have contention. I don’t complain about his, and he doesn’t complain about mine. We simply continue to drift apart little by little because the foundation that we shared when we married has crumbled on my side of the building. Is it my fault? I don’t think so, I had so much trust in the Institution. When I discovered the truth they kept hidden, it undermined all that I had before trusted. My husband is a convert. Even though he was shocked to learn about the stone in the hat, it doesn’t matter to him. Nothing matters to him except for the BOM. He says that is true, so nothing else is important. I have been unable to compartmentalize the way he does. Sometimes I wish I could. I am not looking for him to come over to my way of thinking, just for him to recognize that my doubts and hurt have some validity. I don’t expect that will ever happen. And that hurts too.
(Please forgive the rambling pity party I seem to be having, the day at church was fine, I just miss when I had a strong testimony and no doubts. Life seemed simpler then.)
F&T meeting here. No Easter. And they wonder why people don’t think we are Christian?? Not even an Easter hymn. But I did laugh out loud when the opening prayer giver thanked God profusely for the abundant sunshine, and mentioned a few sentences later that we are fasting for rain. I guess I have to look somewhere for my humor in church. It’s funny you should ask what precipitated my FC, because I was wondering that myself earlier this week, and then I remembered what started it all. I read the essay on Race and the Priesthood. I think I was just surfing around on lds.org, which I do occasionally. I taught youth SS and there is a lot of stuff on there to help. When I read the essay I was stunned. Not so much about the “we don’t really know why the whole thing started” idea, but the idea that women were not allowed to be endowed in the temple. My brain started screaming, “But that has nothing to do with the priesthood!!” Growing up we were told it was an issue of priesthood, when I read that women were banned from the temple endowment I knew it had nothing to do with priesthood and everything to do with race. I was sick to my stomach and literally felt physically ill. From there I read the essay on plural marriage, and while I knew that JS had multiple wives, I never knew he married other men’s wives. There again was what I considered a lie–that has nothing to do with populating the earth with mini-mormons. I felt deceived, and sickened. I have never felt the same since then, and struggle to attend church every week. Sometimes I wish I could turn back the clock, but that isn’t possible so I just fake it for now. Mom3, sorry it was such a tough day. We had ward conference. It was fine, I have stopped listening too closely, although our bishop spoke on the idea of being able to change and be better. That we can all become more converted to the gospel of Jesus Christ. He quoted the Mosiah idea of no more disposition to do evil, but to do good continually. I have always loved that passage, and sometimes that is my guiding principle. But everything else was pretty much the same old same old. And of course we got to hear the newly returned sister missionary tell us to doubt our doubts before we doubt our faith. That almost makes me want to gag now. I know many hear recommend that we pull out the ipad or smart phone and amuse ourselves with a distraction when things get difficult in our meetings, but honestly I don’t want everybody looking at my tech tools and noticing I am surfing on FB. I would like to be a little more subtle than that. But the idea to flee the building was probably a good one–you can go home and retrench. Ann, I think something is going on when the attitude is to excommunicate someone for a blog post. It’s as though leadership is scared, and that scares me. I prefer this forum, where we can talk amongst ourselves with more anonymity. FB is much too public. Sadly, we must hide our true feelings to protect ourselves. That alone is frightening.
Thanks for your temple insights Ray. I have not been to the temple in almost a year. I have never gone that long before, and I wish I could say I miss it, but I don’t. Your comments do remind me of the peaceful spirit that is there. I miss the quiet, but honestly not the endowment session. I should go back while I can, I don’t know what the future will hold for me. No one does. Quote:mom3 wrote:
Thanks for catching that. My fingers were ahead of my brain. I attend a traditional ward, have a calling, a visiting teaching route and friends.
Mom3, that made me suddenly sad to read that. It really hit me that although I have been active all of my life, and I have been in my current ward for 16 years, I have no calling (they think I am too busy, and I am, but it’ s still a bit hurtful), my VT companion apparently handles it without me (it is discouraging to have a route with not one single active sister, and they never return a phone call to us), and I have no one I consider a true friend. I know plenty of the members, but the relationships are pretty shallow. There is no one I could spill my innermost thoughts to. I have noticed over the years that most of the leadership callings are filled by the same people over and over again, just thrown up into the air and they come down into different callings periodically. This feeling of not belonging has definitely made my FC harder. I am grateful for this site, and I do lurk plenty, even when I don’t post. Thanks to all of you who post words of encouragement to us all. (I will admit that tonight I am tired, I have worked 13 days straight, and I am stressed because my mom’s health is not good. Sorry for the Debbie Downer, but it has been a tough day.
SD, just breathe. This is all completely normal, and should be celebrated :clap: I have 4 children, and haven’t found one that agrees with the nothing but group dating until you get serious idea. I am not even sure I think it is really feasible. I encouraged my kids to double date with friends if possible, and to spend time at home with the families. We can be fun and we are a cheap date🙂 . As far as her “asking” you, that really was just testing the waters since she is already seeing him. I had a daughter ask me the same thing. I knew that if I said no she would see him anyway, and it appears your daughter has decided the same. I felt it was safer to say yes, and give the requisite lectures on parking in a car together, bedrooms, etc. I did do something that worked well, and that was not giving a set curfew. I told her what time to be home based on the activity. I usually allowed 45 minutes to an hour for her to arrive home after the movie/dance/etc were over. No need to kill time somewhere while the clock is ticking. You will all do fine, and I agree with the “teach them correct principles and let them govern themselves”. That is one thing I think we an agree that JS got right🙂 I have also found that having high expectations for our kids choices and behaviors can help. Not unreasonable, just high. One time I asked a teacher what was the lowest grade you could get to receive an A on a project. The teacher responded with “if I tell you the lowest grade you could get you wouldn’t aim for anything higher”. So very true. I just told my kids I had great confidence in their ability to make right choices, and that I trusted them to remember what they had been taught. They have not disappointed me.
Thanks Heber, for bumping it. I read it with fascination. I have long wondered to what to ascribe “miracles” or “happenstance”. I have been mulling it over with great thought in the last few days. My mother fell a week ago and is in the hospital. She is elderly and her bones are in poor shape. They x-rayed her leg and determined that not only her tibia was broken completely, but that her artificial knee cap was shattered and the knee itself was damaged. This was very bad and the doctor wasn’t sure if he could repair everything. The surgery went better than anticipated because when they opened up her leg there was no damage to the knee cap or artificial knee. So, was this a miracle, or a doctor who misread the x-rays? I just don’t know. I want to say it was a miracle. That would mean that God intervenes in our lives, and that he truly does watch over us as individuals. Unfortunately, during this FC, I have begun to doubt that. I really can’t point to any real miracles in my life. I want to. I want to believe that God thinks I am worth a miracle, but today, I am just not sure. But, I completely agree that we often see these events as we choose to, and our belief system guides our interpretation. Just a few months ago, it would have been a miracle, and realizing that makes me sad. 😥 From the OP: Quote:I had a very rigid mindset before and I think it kept me actually from feeling the Spirit.
+1
TTT, when I said polar opposites, I was completely serious. I love playing sports and being active, that is not his thing. If he spent all day every day on the computer looking at politics and posting on gospel subjects, he would be just fine. I want to be out and about if I can, and he doesn’t have any desire to do that. I think he is hoping this will just go away. I asked him last week if he would leave me over my FC, and he said he would not. (I actually had a 24 hour period where I liked him and wanted to be close to him. That has been a while.) We don’t talk about my FC because I think it makes him uncomfortable. I need to get past the feeling of disappointment that I married him because of a spiritual witness, and the fact that I don’t really trust those as much as I used to. It has left me very conflicted. It seems to boil down to simply deciding to accept my choice to marry him 10 years ago. Either that or plan to live my life as a single person. I am not going to be married again. And let’s face it, we can’t have sex if we aren’t married, so unless I plan to be celibate for the rest of my life, I need to be married to someone. Thank you everyone. I don’t intend to use this information as justification to use alcohol. This discussion came in the context that the church today has some very different rules than the church JS restored. We were talking about how the WW started not as a commandment, and that over time new rules were put into place. I explained that the culture of the day seemed to play a part in some of the changes. This change in the WW and its enforcement came about during the time of Prohibition. He said that even if members drank alcohol, the leaders surely didn’t. I said they surely did, and here we are 🙂 .There is no intent to use this info to justify a lifestyle change on my part (I am way too cheap to spend money on liquor
😆 ), but I think that seeing the fairly large changes come when society as a whole is demanding the changes makes my point. When Prohibition was repealed it would have been a little awkward for a prophet to say, The Lord had changed his mind.
