Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
In 1983, when I was in the MTC, we had tickets bought for us for the BYU-Utah football game. I am still appreciative of that. It was in Provo. Steve Young threw for about 9000 yards. BYU scored in the 50s. Looking back, and forward, for the time young men and women spend on missions, for the hardship they face at times, buying tickets for them to attend a BYU football game does not sound exorbitant. Nor should it be frowned on, in my opinion. Let them have a few hours of fun. Prop 8 was interesting. Our Elder’s Quorum tried to get a friend and I to go door to door to push the Prop. Both of us had public jobs so we declined. Said president, we found out, was calling us queer lovers behind our backs. Reverse hate? I do think some people, aside from Victor Davis Hanson and Richard Dawkins, have a pretty strong dislike for Mormons in general. Yet, unfortunately, I think the hate is returned in some ways. How? It just is.
The Bubble is up and down the Mountain Time Zone/Mountain West. But I think it is starting to lose its gas. When my wife and I returned to Eastern Idaho in 2002 life had not changed much. (A thirteen year gap?)
But, since the local two year became a four year college, life is changing. The area has been invaded by students, married students, their kids, money grubbing developers, political developments that would make Reaganites seem liberal, family homes and bungalows being bulldozed for apartment complexes whose architects should be strapped, an endless array of fast food restaurants and banking corporations. To go with it, lying politicians, and everything else that goes with “success”. As Hugh Nibley once observed (I paraphrase): when the Nephites lived a life of agriculture things went pretty well. But when they started embracing commerce and business, things went to poo. (He did not say poo…)
One item, innocuous as it may seem? McDonalds cannot move enough coffee during the day. Little coffee trailers have opened, a coffee franchise opened with Java City and Starbucks on the way. You might ask, who is drinking all of that coffee? Well, me for one. But I do not think the little white college handbook is a forcefield keeping students from caffeine. Or vape pens…
In our grocery stores it has been awhile since I have seen a Cosmopolitan magazine turned around so no-one can see the model on the cover. It probably still happens, but not like it used to.
When we returned in 2002 a popular Saturday activity embraced by some of our neighborly sisters was to go to the mall in Idaho Falls and protest, yes protest, the Victoria’s Secret. It was not appropriate they believed. They invited my wife. She declined. Then she wondered where she would shop for our anniversary. But I out did that. One afternoon I wandered into the said Victoria’s and bought my wife perfume for her birthday. I had our twins with me, who might have been 4? Well as I walked out with an oversized bag holding 3 oz of perfume, holding hands with my babies, who should I run into? The ladies protesting, signs and all. The looks on their faces were priceless.
There is a shift that comes with all the trappings people here want. Some might still insist things be done the LDS way, but fewer I think. Nobody would protest Victoria’s anymore. Coffee is not viewed like meth. Students and town folk lack curtesy toward each other. It has just changed. Maybe it is indescribable, but probably not unlike we see all around us.
Minyan Man wrote:
Friedrich wrote:
It is true. Does it still happen? I do not recall. The last viewing I attended. no robes, etc. Just a suit.
Was this a member who was endowed & currently active?
Yes it was.
It is true. Does it still happen? I do not recall. The last viewing I attended. no robes, etc. Just a suit. Roy wrote:
I wonder if there is a desire to keep everyone pretty interchangeable. That way there can be no divisions. I wonder if maybe people on the fringes were getting too fond of Elder Uchtdorf and there might have been efforts to tone him down. Maybe… just speculation on my part.Relevant to this discussion, if all church leaders are more or less the same then their personalities and celebrity can take a backseat and that could in turn help a unified message of Jesus Christ to take center stage.
I have wondered that myself regarding Elder Uchtdorf. Was he too popular? Even my wife called him the Silver Fox. Was there jealousy involved? Speculation, yes!
In my former school district in my former state I worked with several Jehovah’s Witnesses. They were good folks. They treated me well. I never attended a meeting. I actually never thought about doing so. I do believe to be considered fully active you are engaged in at least 10 hours of missionary work a week. As far as shunning goes, I believe I would fail at that. I have just started reading the talks. Elder Bednar is first, as most of you know. I have a hard time believing what comes out of his mouth. I will leave it at that. Aside from that, from what I watched, as you all have typed: some were good, some were bad. I just know if I had a world wide audience, I would be bad.
I have noticed more recently, after decades of conference talks, they sound the same. The last of the pioneer prophets and apostles would each have a distinct conference talk personality. Now the tone feels the same. The sentence structure sounds the same. (Whether it is or not, I guess I should check the typed versions…) I think non apostle speakers have to have talks pre-read. A hunch, nothing based on fact.
I always enjoy Elder Uchtdorf. President Holland has also delivered some memorable Book of Mormon talks, you do not hear those a lot anymore. Elder Ballard’s talk, to me, was similar to Elder Haight’s final talk. Elder Haight talked about life, love and Ruby. Maybe more talks about life and loved ones would be more meaningful.
I am not, but I have known some who have/are. (Addicts that is…) What I think worries me is their belief, as has been pummeled into their minds, that they are vile addicts. Which then brings up the, is pornography an addiction or a bad habit? I know a gentleman who had been called to run a church (LDS) lead 12 steps type group to help pornography addicts. It was a calling. Having a medical background he read up on the issue as much as he could. At one point he talked to the stake reps above him, letting them know he believed porn to be more a bad habit and less of an addiction. Within two weeks he was released. I had moment with a stake presidency member over the subject one sunny Sunday. He would go non-stop about men in the church watching pornography constantly. I informed him that research is showing women 17-35 years of age are catching up to men in their consumption of pornographic materials. I should have kept my mouth shut. He did not like that and told me no sister would watch such vile material. OK I guess.
I think the Church’s approach to the subject, particularly regarding married couples, at times has done more harm than good. While at the same time individuals (LDS Volk) telling me part of their married date night often includes the couple watching pornography together. The suggestion of such an activity in my marriage would go over like a toot in an elevator.
The harm? While I do not believe pornography gives the world Ted Bundys, I believe it has the potential to ruin marriages, and possibly pornography has more impact on people’s careers. Watching such material is a firing offense with most companies I would think. But, if you have to watch adult material at work, knowing your are going to get kicked to the curb, that is a portrait of addiction in my mind.
I am not sure Plato would have mentioned Atlantis if it had been located in the South China Sea. The theory I have liked best is the idea presented by a Sacramentan that the Book of Mormon lands were in and around the eastern Great Lakes. I need to reread his book. It is out of print.
Well, have a good evening.
I lost my grandfather when I was almost 50. He was well into his 90s. He was baptized LDS, but had no interest. He did love his family though. My brother used to call me the Prince, because my brother would tell me grandpa loved me the most. There is no jealousy in that, my brother would say that was the way it went. After my mission my father and I had a moment of not seeing eye to eye one morning. I fully expected to get the Hell kicked out of me. That did not happen, thankfully, and I ended up moving in with Grandpa. I had not been a studious college student, but Grandpa told me to head back to Ricks and get educated. He helped me from Ricks to BYU, through graduate school. He talked me out of law school, his reasoning? “You become an attorney, you will lie everyday of your life.” We had three or four summers together. We farmed, hit the local buffets, watched A’s baseball, we had a blast.
I remember him flying up to visit my family for a week. One Sunday morning he walked out and asked what time church was? So he hopped in the car with us and off we went. I forget what the occasion was, but a hymn was being performed. I had never seen him cry, but there he sat, tears rolling down his cheeks. He made no effort to wipe them away.
I feel your loss. I am sorry for your loss.
Quote:The LDS church really isn’t set up for freshness. General conferences where the talks are largely indistinguishable from any other general conference of the last 20 years. Sacrament meetings and second hour lessons being echoes of general conference. The goal doesn’t appear to be freshness, the goal appears to be to get everyone on the same page with their beliefs.
I have noticed the same talk, tone of voice, lack of dynamic differences in talks for sometime. I have told my kids to watch/listen to talks from the 70s and 80s when the last of the pioneer church leaders were making their last stand. There was variety. And confidence in what they said. The Book of Mormon was front and center, Christ was mentioned regularly, and they only told you to tithe once. Of course that is romanticized, but when have we heard someone bare testimony like Elder McConkie in the last 35+ years? There seems to have been a clamping down on what is presented now. The irony of Christ-less conference talks are the length our current church president has gone to remodel the branding to make sure we will always use Christ’s name referencing the church. I still utter Mormon and always will.
