[greenapples]

I thought I would post here as it has been awhile. I have pretty well left the LDS church. I have chosen a different style of Christianity that better fits me.

When I was a TBM I never felt good enough. I guess it is safe to say that I felt like a dirty old pan that never looked clean no matter how many times you washed it.

After my moments of disbelief and exploring other styles of Christianity I found that I could feel truly forgiven.

I also felt that I gradually started to change and my life got better. Life was less stressful.

[greenapples]

I had my moments of believing that all Prophets at their moments of being a man of God and they had their moments of being a man of the flesh.

through personal studies I feel that Joseph Smith was never truly a prophet to begin with. He and his friends helped create a religion.

[greenapples]

I remember knocking on the doors of the inactive with my EQ president. I remember thinking that I was helping Jesus find lost sheep. 12+ years later maybe I think I was among the lost. I have attended other church groups. It is refreshing to hear something different. It is also good to know I can stop attending these churchas and I won’t be harassed for not attending.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G530AZ using Tapatalk

[greenapples]

I always personally disagreed with the idea that only worthy people can feel the spirit.

Honestly I am not totally sure I believe in a literal Holy Ghost or at least not in the Mormon sense.

If there is such a thing my relationship with the Holy Ghost sure is complicated too.

I feel so strongly inspired to pursue a certain career field and it doesn’t work out. If the Holy Ghost is real it sure does like to point me into dead ends.

I feel like I need to walk my Journey without looking for a magical feeling to appear.

I wish you the best of luck on your personal Journey with or without this Holy Ghost.

May the Force Be With You.

[greenapples]

Minyan Man wrote:

greenapples wrote:

I think it is time for me to either fully embrace the religion of my up bringing or to walk away.

It is time for me to really consider how big or small my little mustard seed of faith really is and if it should be planted in my mormon garden or planted elsewhere.

I wish you well. Keep us informed of your progress.

(2 liter of soda a day? Really?)

Thanks for the support and yes sir I can easily guzzle 2 liters of soda. I could maybe even drink 4 liters of soda by myself.

My biggest down fall when I don’t bother dieting properly is the amount of sugar I can drink. If I switch from soda over to green tea I can easily lose 5 – 10 pounds on that alone. If I cut out all sugar, most starch and wheat I can lose much more.

I thought I would come back in here and update y’all on what is going on with Green apples. Of course if you read my writings on the NOM you already know.

Basically I am in the process of branching out. I am attending a Unitarian Universalist church while also attending my Singles Ward. It’s a fun group over at the UU church but there aren’t really any young folks close to my age. There aren’t many girls my age either. I realized that I was programmed at a young age to look for Mormon girls to date.

That’s when I thought ” Why do you have to date girls directly from church?”

The answer of course is that I do not have to.

[greenapples]

I have been switching up my diet for weight loss over the past year. I have been doing plenty of research on the foods that are ideal for weight loss.

I have noticed that when I don’t get enough sleep or if I am overly stressed out then my weight loss stops.

I have read plenty of articles and watched plenty of videos that basically says that caffeine will disrupt sleep patterns and cause an increase in the stress hormone cortisol.

I am thinking about handing in my Jack Mormon club card or at least put it away for awhile.

I have stopped drinking coffee and started drinking black tea. Tomorrow I will switch over to green tea and then eventually I will just stop drinking tea or consuming any caffeine and see how well I do without anything in my system.

The interesting thing about this is I started drinking tea and coffee to get myself off the sodas. Now I will just be switching over to water.

I will say that I felt more healthy drinking my one cup of coffee in the morning than I did drinking 2 liters of soda (sometimes more) per day. It is interesting that I could become slightly more healthy as a Jack Mormon than my bad habbits as a TBM. I suppose staying away from soda would be against the spirit of the law in the WOW. It would be interesting to see if I can just be awake and alert with the new style of dieting that I have been trying out for the past year. (The 100 diet plan is the basis of my diet however I am slowly turning Paleo.)

I am not just doing this for diet/health reasons though. I have been considering what my Bishop was asking. I may want to take the next big step and go through the temple.

I have been using this site, NOM and various mormon style podcasts as a means to tread water for the past 5 years.

I think it is time for me to either fully embrace the religion of my up bringing or to walk away.

It is time for me to really consider how big or small my little mustard seed of faith really is and if it should be planted in my mormon garden or planted elsewhere.

[greenapples]

My YSA ward was assigned to clean the church building the first 3 months of this year. The first month I never went because I honestly would forget and I think everyone else did too. My bishop was kind of looking for a calling to give Green Apples so he put me in charge of promoting the cleaning crew. I passed around sign up sheets in EQ and RS. I also posted reminders on my YSA ward’s private facebook page. I created some fun little pictures and used poetic license with my reminders. We had a pretty good turn out after that. One of the best turn outs was the time that one of the activity committees chose to bring a few boxes of donuts. People will show up if there is food.

We didn’t clean on Saturday because no YSA would want to give up their Saturday. We would do it on Thursday. Unfortunately this was also the same day that other members of the stake would use our building for leadership meetings. Some rooms would not get vacuumed and trash emptied. I noticed that the other wards will pass the buck to the Young Men. Young Deacons Teachers and Priests would collect the trash on Sunday. (FORCING THE CHILDREN TO WORK ON SUNDAY SHAME SHAME SHAME! WHAT ARE WE TEACHING THOSE CHILDREN )

My pet peeve isn’t so much the ward members being assigned to clean. I am slightly annoyed when only a small few show up. My big issue is when people don’t clean up after themselves. If one group needs to use the kitchen CLEAN IT UP AFTER THE ACTIVITY IS OVER!! DON’T SAVE IT FOR THE ASSIGNED CLEANING CREW! TAKE THE TRASH OUTSIDE TO THE DUMPSTER! IT ISN’T HARD TO DO!

If everyone were to do their part to keep the buildings clean then there wouldn’t need to have an assigned cleaning crew. If it became proper protocol to clean after activities the church would already be clean.

[greenapples]

thanks Maybe I will visit here more often.

[greenapples]

DBMormon wrote:

I am curious here to your perception of how LDS podacasts have effected your spirituality and your testimony.

There are multiple podcasts out there

MormonStories

MormonMatters

MormonExpression

Athoughtfulfaith

and of course mine MormonDiscussion – http://mormondiscussion.podbean.com” class=”bbcode_url”>http://mormondiscussion.podbean.com

Some are more faithful then others but each seems to validate the person struggling with reconciling the larger more complex narrative.

1.) Have these been a help to you in keeping your faith?

2.) Have they increased your spirituality?

3.) Have they increased your testimony of the restored gospel?

4.) Please don’t flatter me, what do you see as your favorite? why? What is it about that particular podcast that keeps you tuning in.

Bill Reel

1.) Have these been a help to you in keeping your faith?

I have listened to most of these podcasts at least once. I feel that these podcasts have aided me in treading water. I stumbled upon the Mormon stories podcast during the hardest times of my faith issues. I had also been studying psychology in school and the Fowler Stages of Faith I felt help me come to terms with what I was going through. I appreciated the fact that many Mormon podcasts including Mormon stories brought up the Fowler Stages of Faith. 2.) Have they increased your spirituality?

I feel that they have aided me in knowledge and coming to terms with some of the faith issues I had. Once I began to sort things out I was able to find peace and relax. I don’t feel that I am any more spiritual from any podcast. 3.) Have they increased your testimony of the restored gospel?

No. I once went from claiming that I knew everything about the restored gospel was true. I claimed knowledge. After the faith issues I came to realize that I do not know anything. I have faith in certain aspects of the religion. Perhaps that faith might grow further as time goes on. I don’t know for sure at this point. 4.) Please don’t flatter me, what do you see as your favorite? why? What is it about that particular podcast that keeps you tuning in.

I don’t feel that I have listened to enough mormondiscussion to really have good feel for what it is about. I only listened to the Transitional Phases of Faith episode. For some reason this episode cut out 9 minutes early. The 21 minutes that I did hear seemed interesting at first but then I found myself disappointed. Based on what I heard I was a little annoyed with the fact that there was this attempt to shorten, cut and remodel the Fowler stages of faith. It seemed to me that this alternative blue, red and green phases didn’t tell the whole story. It seemed like something straight out of an institute lesson. It seemed to me like the blue phase was Fowler Stage 1. The red phase was the painful transition between 1 – the tail end of 2 and the green phase was Fowler stage 3 where you still attend church, have a testimony but begins to decide to think on their own. Perhaps there was some Fowler stage 4 traits found in the red phase but It totally missed the portion of stage 4 where there is peace found outside of religion. It didn’t really address the fact the there is some much to be learned outside of religion. The Green phase totally misses out on the fact that there can be a wonderful happy form of faith where one does not need to have a literal belief of religion but rather a strong appreciation for what it stands for and the good that it can do for others. Then again the last 9 minutes was cut. Maybe within those 9 minutes it totally does address those things. Once those 9 minutes have been restored I can come to a true opinion of that particular episode. Out of all the other podcast choices I find MormonExpression to be a little more entertaining. There is a topic of discussion with a panel of people having a group discussion. I find Mormonstories to have more information. Even with a Superior sources of information Mormonstories has a tendency to be long winded. There is almost always multiple hour segments within each new episode. To listen to an entire episode I have to give up multiple hours. Luckily with upgrades of technology since the start of my journey I now have the ability to download the long episodes and put them on an mp3 player. I can listen to them on a nice long walk. I guess it is safe to say that Mormonexpression and Mormonstories are my favorite flavors of the Mormon related podcasts when I want to listen to them.

[greenapples]

Looking back at the Primary days I always thought that it was rather silly that the boys and girls were separated into separate classes the final year. Back then it was the Blazers and the Merry Misses. I’m not sure what they call them now.

I have also had problems with sticking around all 3 hours of church as of late. I will go to sacrament and I will usually attend Sunday School. Priesthood has always been hard for me to stick around. It is mainly hard because guys have a tendency to speak so very monotone and it bores me to no end. Men have a tendency to speak slower as well so they talk extra slow in Priesthood. At least in Sunday school the guys will shorten their boring stories and talk faster to keep up with the ladies.

I would be in favor of giving the women priesthood for the sake of having a revised Sunday School program that involved both the teachings of Sunday school while also teaching priesthood principals. That way we can do away with the 3rd hour and only have to be at church for 2. Or maybe even 1 hour if we just had Sacrament meeting taking the sacrament and do away with the talks. Just do sacrament and then the sundayschool/priesthood lesson. We could have all the children dismissed for Primary right after sacrament and then they can have fun for an hour and only have to be in those stiff itchy church clothes for 1 hour.

I’ve heard it theorized that if they gave women priesthood many men who feels the pressures of being a good priesthood leader in the home will no longer bother to fit the standards. They would become drunks who wouldn’t care about anything because the wonderful wife has it all taken care of. They keep the Priesthood to the men to keep the men in line.

Something I remember hearing from listening to some of the old Mormon Story podcasts is that all 15 top men of the church would have to agree in order to make any major changes in the priesthood. Some of the old stubborn men had to die off before they stopped restricting the priesthood from the African brothers of the church.

Maybe one day stubborn old men will die off and we will have 15 people who are okay with women in the priesthood. Maybe one day we will have a woman Prophet. As it stands right now it probably won’t happen anytime soon. 😥

[greenapples]

My last post was a bit of a rant post. I was able to go to Costco with my mother to get some of the main items I needed to continue with my diet.

Today I began to think a bit about all the things that I have read about the interesting side of church history. I thought about the church as it is today and I wondered and pondered if I really wanted to stay. I decided that I shouldn’t make my decision on the church as it was in the covered wagon days but that I should make my decision based on the organization as it is today. I should not wonder if I can fit into the church but rather I should wonder how the church can fit me.

Earlier I had members of my Clan come visit and we went to see a local band at a bar. I drank and I drank too much too fast. Everything didn’t stop spinning until the next day. :crazy: Luckily I drank enough water to prevent a full on hangover.

Normally if I do drink I will limit myself to 1 or 2 drinks. At a party the glass is always refilled. Everyone else has earned the ranks of a heavy drinker and it takes many drinks for them to get buzzed. I am such a light weight that I am buzzed after one drink and everything feels numb and spinning after about 4.

If I was at a church game party the hardest thing they would ever serve is Dr. Pepper. I can’t get drunk off that.

I was thinking about this at church today. I didn’t stick around much longer past sacrament meeting. I had many things on my mind and I decided to take a walk. Luckily for me I don’t wear a traditional suit. Normally it’s a dressy grey sports coat or my trusty tuxedo jacket with a black shirt, tie and grey pants. underneath my black shirt is a regular T shirt. In the past I have just taken off my jacket, tie and black shirt and threw them in my trunk. I am free to go wherever I want without looking too churchy. Today I just put my jacket in the trunk along with the tie. I unbuttoned the top button of my black shirt and un tucked it.

Sometimes I get more out of Sunday when I walk somewhere else.

It is hard to stick around when I’ve heard the same lesson time and time again. It is even harder for me to listen to the same comments from someone who truly believes in everything. I dislike the comments that people seem to be overly snobby and self righteous. It is like they are trying to teach everyone else to live by their example. :sick:

I will still try to make it a point to go to Sacrament but beyond that I can’t make any promises. I kind of feel like the last remaining 2 hours could be spent doing something else. :yawn:

Sundays seem to be more like a copied day that is forever re looped. I think it is okay to change the channel from time to time.

I am okay with going to the other activities and the interactions at those activities seem more real. People act differently when they are dressed in workout gear playing a sport. :clap:

[greenapples]

WHY DID THE MOUSE CROSS THE ROAD?

BECAUSE SOMEONE CUT THE CHEESE!

[greenapples]

I AM BACK! NOW AN UPDATE!

I still have plans to do the military. My issue has been getting my true waste line measurements and weight number down.

I am somewhat annoyed with the fact that in the past I asked my parents to hook me up with a Gym membership. I figured they would have said YES for reasons that in the past that had bought gym memberships for my other siblings.

Sadly they said NO!! 👿

I told them that I wanted the gym membership so that I could get down to the proper measurements for the military. It’s like they are supportive of the idea of Military but their actions seem to prove otherwise.

My oldest brother got back home from teaching English in another country. Since he has gotten back home he has been lounging in his room, watching T.V. and wearing his pajamas most of the day.

My parents offered him a gym membership : He has money to buy his own. He would benefit from losing some weight but it is not a requirement for a potential career.

I recently bought a new diet book and asked for groceries for this diet. My parents gladly got me food that lasted the first week and partly into the 2nd week. I ran out of the food required to fulfill all the meal plans

I made a grocery list of things that I would need to continue with my meal plans and put it on the fridge. It has been there for well over a week. They have not gotten these items for me.

Now I am required to try my best to follow the guidelines of the book as opposed to following the meal plans that are laid out.

I make a grocery list and nothing happens but whenever my older brother wants some ice cream to fulfill his sweet tooth IT’S OFF TO THE STORE THEY GO!! :thumbdown:

I kind of get the feeling that they don’t want me to succeed. Perhaps there is some kind of a double standard between their Oldest Son and the Youngest.

Regardless of the reasons it only fuels my desires to succeed even more. This way I can say that I achieved my goals ON MY OWN!

Once I’m down to the proper weight numbers I can start the process to join the military. I can fulfill my goal of leaving Washington State before the age of 30.

Sadly I am already 4 years past my personal goals to be out on my own. The downward spiral of the local economy has made that tough for me.

I guess I can get both the moving out goal and leaving the State at the same time.

I have lost weight with the diet book I’ve been using. Hopefully I can get down the rest of the way.

BY HOOK OR BY CROOK I WILL :think:

GREEN[/color][/size] “>APPLES[/size]

[greenapples]

You are a better man than me Roy. If I could do it all over again I would have allowed the police to take this man to the holding tank. If they found drugs or drug paraphernalia they would have gladly held him for longer than the standard 8 hours.

insomniac wrote:

Thank you, greenapples, for your point of view. From this experience of mine, I can certainly relate as to how the frustration builds. Before mine, I was the sort that would let everyone else walk all over me – maybe even the one who would have let the guy back in (though technically on someone else’s orders, if so). Something tells me, though, that quite a few people wished they had the moxie to do what you did – or had done it – but couldn’t admit it publicly. I know plenty of people in the church who would still make a point to criticize you to your face even if they felt that way.

Well this was before the age of 25 which = pre frontal brain lobes. I acted with emotion more so than logic. If something like this were to happen again I will handle it differently. I also think that the overall membership of my current ward has enough of a backbone to escort a drunken druggie away from the general group and find away for this person to leave even if it meant to be in the safe custody of the police.

You are right though people have enjoyed criticizing. I think some people in the church really enjoy drama and making sure that they voice their opinion as away to “punish” Greenapples. They aren’t my bishop and they are not God so I don’t worry about their criticisms too much.

[greenapples]

Hello Brother Insomnia. It’s good to see that there is another creature of the night lurking and posting in the forums.

I’ve been reading through the posts of this thread and I thought that I would let you know that you are not a bad guy.

You have a legitimate concern for the young children who could potentially fall victim to a pedophile.

I would imagine the issue with this young man is a slight headache for all the local leaders. They are aware that something happened but this young man seems to have the desire to stay within the church. Unfortunately the local leaders are stuck with the potential of this kid falling out line while also trying to give him a warm welcoming hand of fellowship in the church.

Personally years ago I had an issue with a young man who handled himself in a disrespectful manner. This man had a habit of showing up to church activities under the strong influence of drugs and alcohol. Although certain local leaders in my singles ward would often ask this man to leave the Bishop at the time seemed to have a soft spot for him. Perhaps he felt that he could help him but this guy just did not want to be sober. Even when he was sober-ish he would harass the ladies verbally and was also physically pokey and grabby, which is something a religious girl isn’t really into.

One night this man showed up to an activity. This particular activity was poorly planned and put together at last minute. It seemed for the most part that only the people assigned to certain committees was there. I had enough of this drunken druggie so I took it upon myself to ask him to leave. When he refused I escorted him out of the building and locked the doors up. I had planned to wait 5 minutes and make sure that this guy left the parking lot. Unfortunately an overly tenderhearted person of the church let him back in and he was violently angry. he shoved me to the ground and I hit my head pretty good. The room seemed to spin for a moment. I got up and a long story short I escorted him out to the parking lot where we proceeded to have a fist fight. Technically no one wins a fight but it ended with him knocked out cold on the sidewalk. I checked his vitals and he was still alive. I went back inside and filled a plastic cup up with water and went back outside where I proceeded to dump it on this guys face. In a wet cough he was awake. I made sure he got up and I said ” This isn’t a place for drunks and druggies. Church isn’t for everyone and maybe it’s not for you or at least not right now. Do everyone a favor and go home and don’t come back here again.”

After that incident this man never really came back to church. He had been living a lifestyle that was contrary to the standards of the church and he fully submersed himself in that lifestyle more so as time went on.

Of course there was all kinds of gossip about this story. Everyone felt the need to take aside and everyone likes to add their own twist of flavor to the story. I had all kinds of people in the local stake ask me my side of the story on this event. Some people felt like I was in the wrong and I had no right to do what I did. Others understood where I was coming from but felt that I should have handled it differently. One or two individuals told me that I did what I felt was right at the time and that I shouldn’t worry about it.

I have my own fair share of disagreements with local church leadership and local church members. If I am a bad guy than so be it but let it be known that I had good intentions.

Even if you are marked as a prideful bad guy you have pride and concern with good intentions.

Take care and may sleep find you before sunrise.

GREEN[/color][/size] “>APPLES[/size]

[Author]

Posts