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Thank you nibbler for the quick reply. I like the idea of just saying they are wanting to help people during this trying time. I have been thinking alot about this thread i started and have been reading a few past threads. So i believe Gods love is unconditional. Thats what i wrote about before. I still believe that. I want to believe that and need a God in my life that hears and listens empathetically to me. But here is my problem. Us humans dont love like that. So I’m thinking about what Roy said in his previous post about how he needed boundaries around cetain people. So do I. Especially around certain situations with people.
So the thing is I have mentioned before that I believe God loves each of us even when we are mad at Him. So does He have boundaries with us? Thats a really hard one for me. I have a bit of time off at Christmas time and have spent some just relaxing and having some boundaries ( if you will) from some people. Its been nice and refreshing. I have had time to think about me and what i believe a bit more.
So a part of me ( at least right now) wants to believe that God cares enough to make sure he takes care of himself. I mean really people tell Him all their problems and even get mad at Him. Doesnt he need a boundary or a break? I have more understanding when a child is angry at me and can at times even accept it. Sometimes i need to walk away though and other times i say some thing like, ‘ its ok to feel angry but your behavior needs to change.’ Would God say that to me?. Sometimes i even say to my teenage daughter, ” something must be bothering you because you dont ussually act like that”. As I write this I think God is more inclined to speak empathetically. But i think that is how He would act to his children, which i guess we all are.
So its adults that im more concerned with. Does God have brothers and sisters? Does He have a mother, father, wife, or friends? I mean Jesus does. Yea but He is not the one we pray to. Did or does Jesus have boundaries?
So I’m saying I need that empathetic God in my life but im feeling sad that he has to put up with so much abuse towards him. If its good for us as humans to have boundaries to bad behavior and we are suposed to be like God then i would think god would need boundaries but still unconditionally love each of us. Maybe he has a balance too. I dont know? Does he have feeling? Does he feel hurt when people hurt him?
So thats it. Im not sure if this lady accually said to my co worker that she was offended. If she did say that then maybe she was offended. But if she didnt use those words and was just telling my co worker and others sitting in with the conversation, that she was sad or hurt even Im not sure she was offended. Maybe you guys already tried to explain your view and i just dont understand, but do you guys think being hurt by something is the same as taking offence?
I stopped talking to a friend once for about a week. Before that time i was talking to her at least once a week. I stopped talking to her because i felt she was telling me things i didnt agree with. So i ended up in a conversation with a group of people and this friend after that week. The friend said to me some thing like this, ” i havent heard from you in a week”. and then she said, “did i say something that offended you”. Of course i didnt feel like anything she said I was offended by. It was just that i didnt agee with her. I just didnt want to be a part of something i didnt agree with. I talked with her again after that for a while but the friendship did end eventualy because i wasnt benefiting me. I didnt feel i took offence. Sure it was sad that it ended but i felt it was just a decision i made.
Thank you Dark Jedi for the information about where tithing goes. That gives me alot to consider and does change my perspective. I am guessing but dont know for sure ( if some one does know it would be great to know) that the up keep of temples and even churches is done by tithing. By that i dont mean cleaning ( i no that is done by members). As write this i think about memories i used to have. I remember how much i loved going to the temple to see the flowers and how beautiful they were when i went. Even flowers in peoples yards were pretty. I once had some flowers in my yard that grew so beautiful it reminded me of the flowers at the temple. The ones at the temple grew tall and i felt that is what in part made the pretty. So i guess what i was thinking and hoping is that the temple grounds are beautified by tithing which unfortunatly brings up another question.. How does the church pay their employees? That cant be with tithing i would think? Does anyone know?
Thanks every one for you contributions to my posts.
Curt, thanks for sharing what works for you.. It does seem easier to pay tithing for the people and not nessaserally the church itself. Thank you also for sharing what you are now considering doing and your truth that you might not do it. I have a lot to figure out about the temple before it would be something i could do. But maybe i can pay my tithing for my mom and the people i do know that go. I drive by the temples at times and still think they are.pretty buildings. I could pay just to keep our cities pretty. When i went to the temple in the passed i went mostly to feel the peace there and to receive personal revelation. Even before my faith crisis really began i really didn’t go to the endowment sessions. I think that part would even be harder now. I dont feel like i can go now anyways with me missing so much church.
Any ways i appreciate your experience. I pay on my net pay as well. But also have paid when i get my taxes back.
With you considering other options it makes me think about mine. I have paid on my income for the month but have just not paid on child support. I have paid in the passed for that because my mom did when she got child support. Not that its my daughters decision, but Im sure if she knew i was paying she wouldn’t want it paid. I guess i just need to decide how i feel about it. I have it planned for the month to pay it, i just havent.
I really think talking to my daughter last Sunday was the right thing to do. Im not sure what she is thinking for sure but i really feel with me not going to church last week helped my daughter know that we as people in this world really do have a choice. So this is what happened today. I did decide to go to sacrament meeting. I really felt i was okay to go. So I told my daughter beforehand that i was. She didnt come with me but when i got home she was ready to go somewhere. She had called here friend to go to church with her. Thats. Where she is right now. She hadnt been to church in a while. Roy thank for sharing you experience. It gives me confidence to go forward. It was interesting this week that my daughter went to a church activity with her friend who attends the church of a different religion. She has gone there before but it had been a few months. We even prayed over our dinner together the other night. It was kind of hard for me because i dont know if God is the one who accually gave us the food i was praying over. Its one thing to be grateful ( which i find very helpful in my life) but to be grateful that God gave us it is different. It could be Him who gave us our food but im not sure right now.
I was glad we prayed together anyways. Its not what i was thinking at the time but that experience showed my daughter you can be spiritual with out going to church. I prayed that day because i wanted to even though it was hard.
I think it will be harder to show my mom i can do that because first she doesnt live with me and second shes an adult who has stronger beliefs ingrained in her. But because of your story Roy that you just shared i have more hope going forward. Thanks again
Thank you Heber13 and Roy for your nice comments. I have been thinking during the week if i am going to go to church or not. I probably wont decide until saturday or sunday morning. My mom can be very empathetic at times with many things and then every once in a while she is the opposite. I think what would be hard for her is that me and her are the active ones in the family. We are the ones that have always made the good choices. I think i mentioned how my sisters all tried drugs and alcohol and my brother too. I think for the most part they all are doing better (not perfect though) So maybe i think that she thinks that i will start making some of those choices too. Maybe i think she doesnt believe a person can make good choices with out the church. I dont know for sure. I guess i will keep going forward.
Thanks Gerald for sharing your experience. I did feel like she had the black and white thinking when it came to my problem i was talking about. Ok i decided not to go to church today. My daughter was home. It was really quiet in my house. My daughter woke up first and i had a feeling she was wondering why i didnt go to church. After a while she came in my room and asked me why i didnt go. I told here i felt i needed to stay home. She was content but i also told her that a person can be good and not go to church. I also told here I’m going to go to church when i want. And told her i still might at time but it will be when i want to.. she smiled and told her she is a good person and has still chosen to live the word of wisdom and the law of chastity ( I used different word though).. I also told her that if she ever wanted to go to church i would be glad to go with her any time. p.s. i also told one of my inactive sisters a few days ago that i havent been going to church all the time and part of the reason why. She understood. I felt accepted by her. The one hard part was i told her not to tell my active mom because i didnt know if she could handle that. Im not sure how that will work out. I guess time will tell.
Thanks everyone
Thank you Roy. It is so interesting because over the last while i have been once in a while about my chuldhood and going to church. Most of the time i didnt feel like i fit in. My classmates tried to include me at times. I think it was mostly leaders though. I thought it was because of my upbringing (and maybe it still is) I’ve mentioned before that i came from a disfunctional home life and still believe that was a part of my problems. Although some of the disfunction could be church related. When i changed to a singles ward when i was a young adult i enjoyed the people there more. So i guess i would say i got along with them felt a part of the ward.
I will tell you though after my mission i went to college and two of my friends were not members. I still associated with members but was close to the other two. There were times in big groups of members i didnt always feel comfortable. It might have been other issues back then. Im not surre.
I will tell you though the co worker that stood up for me at lunch today the most I think is not a member or inactive. She was so validating to me. I just need to remember to not talk about certain things during lunch so the orthadox member isnt a part of it. Like you said Roy i can still be friendly though.
It was so interesting that 2 people that have been inactive in there lives got up and bote their testimony about it. One of them had just came back after a year and said she has always believed even if she hasnt gone to church. Well maybe i dont believe everything in the church but i still do in some things maybe just in a different way. I dont think this girl has had a faith crisis. Interesting anyways.
I know a woman who went inactive. I dont talk to her alot but she is one of the kindest people i know. I always felt she was a good example of a member of our church even if she didnt go. I have told my my daughter how i feel about this lady.
I think about this concept aliot. I dont know if its right but this is what i believe. I think God does love unconditionally. I definetlly see there ore conditions that involve the church. And the people in and probably out of the church too dont nessasarally love the way God does. I do feel like people in the church do love with contions like ” Im going to love yoy and if ido maybe you will become active again”. I feel that kind of stuff alot. I just cant see God doing that. Ive menttioned my daughter bere before. Shes a young teenager and is in active in the church. She struggles with school. Both of those experiences have got me to really think about unconditional love. I really only want her to be active if she wants to. I want to love her either way. I want her to know i love her whether she struggles with school or not.
Its challenging to show that love but i really try.
I think empathy is important to show. I think God is a very empathetic person. When we are feeling mad even at him he is empatetic about it.
Im sure God is glad when my daughter is sucseful at school but he would never leave her if she wasnt.
