Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
SilentDawning wrote:
Was talking to my daughter who has a lot of empathy. She has this uncanny ability to determine how others are feeling. Not just me, but others (nothing supernatural, she is usually correct, sometimes makes errors, butis VERY observant and tells me she FEELS how others are feeling sometimes).
She observed how my parents tend to favor my brother and sister when we were visiting them recently. She asked why, and I commented on how excluding them from the temple and adopting a set of controversial LDS beliefs was a contributing cause. She said “but the Lord will bless you for making that choice”….
I guess I kind of rolled my eyes as I no longer believe I made the rigth decision excluding them from the wedding as non-members by getting a temple marriage. Personally, I’m not sure that there is a direct connection between pro-Church choices and eternal blessings. There have been times when I have not been pro-Church in my behavior (and that means keeping certain commandments such as garment-wearing, sabbath day or tithing). Yet the temporal and other blessings have at times increased due to less stress, greater inner peace, and even greater employment opportunities.
She said “You don’t believe the Lord will bless you for the choices you made in the church…do you???”
I went to reply and she said “Now you’re going to try to back-pedal the feelings you just said and justify that you do have faith, aren’t you???”.
I was speechless, as I was trying to qualify my reaction and feelings, sort of like she said….but was having trouble processing such a blunt and insightful charge against my thinking. And yes, I was in back-pedal mode.
I asked if she believed that blessings attached to those kind of Church behaviors. And she said “I do”.
I complemented her on her faith.
She said “
you don’t have faith anymore, do you….!”Wow, what a terrible experience.
Not sure what to do now. I know my role as a father is critical in her own development, and she is a gem of a TBM. She takes my advice and has neutralized unhealthy church reactions, and I don’t want to leave her with nothing to fall back on or believe in. Comments?
As I see my faith continually falling apart, this conversation is one of my biggest fears. To those with experience, how old would you start talking to kids about this. My oldest is 6 and she is very keen about the church.Sent from my GT-I9100M using Tapatalk 4 Beta
While I loved trek as a youth, I have a difficult time with it as a sentient adult. I have a hard time reconciling my ‘spiritual’ experiences from trek as more than just experiences where I was either manipulated (water rations for humility?) into feeling the spirit, or where group activities were used to help us feel the spirit. I think sometimes we can feel powerful emotions being involved in something big like this, but often it isn’t the spirit. I have felt similar emotions at the start of a mountain bike race, singing the national anthem and as we shared our experiences around the camp fire on college backpacking trips. For these reasons, among others I have a difficult time with these Mormon role playing camps. Our ward is doing Moroni’s Quest this summer and I feel relieved that I am no longer in young men’s for this. Before I quit my calling I was worried that I wouldn’t be able to match the kids enthusiasm for this event, as sometimes I tend to get my grumpy, jaded side get the best of me.
Sent from my GT-I9100M using Tapatalk 4 Beta
Wow HSAB you described more perfectly these past couple of months. I haven’t posted on here for a while as I just can’t seem to figure out which way to go. Like you I have lost my faith. I have no clue which direction I am going, so for now I am just lurking in the shadows at church as I have ‘quit’ my calling as I just couldn’t teach the things u was being asked too. Good luck, I will keep lurking here and am interested in following your story. Sent from my GT-I9100M using Tapatalk 2
Kipper wrote:I am way more active than most in my age group and it’s going to be hard to not wear a tank top while out fishing or taking my shirt off on a hike. I also ride mountain bikes, motocross and surf. I don’t plan to wear garments on the way to, during or after many of those activities so what do I say during my next interview? I also am not going to sleep in them every night. That just does not make sense to me especially when camping.
Like had been said by others, outs nobodies business what underwear you wear. I also mountain bike and never wear garments when I ride, and I have taken my shirt off on many hot hikes too. Even in my more believing days I wouldn’t get uptight about it.
Sent from my GT-I9100M using Tapatalk 2
I too enjoyed the post. I think the section talking about the sex act being what constitutes the transition from betrothed to married answers a question I posted a while back about what traditional marriage looked like. I wondered if a wedding was essential way back when, but it sounds like it was less formal than our current interpretation. It’s that correct? Maybe those today who are ‘living in sin’ in long term, committed relationships might just be closer to traditional marriage than we once thought. Today at church, as my insides were feeling like they were tied in knots, I happened across one of the bishopric members and asked if I could have a few minutes. I told him I felt like my time had come and that I needed to be released because I was feeling burned out in my calling and that this feeling was compounded by testimony/belief issues. He asked if I wanted to sit down and meet with the bishop over it and I told him that I wasn’t sure if there was much point, as I knew the standard bishop recommendations are to read, pray and attend the temple. I also told him I have been trying each of those and I don’t seem to find peace or answers in the process. He followed up by questioning whether my belief issues were in the church, or in God in general. I had a really difficult time answering that question. I want to believe in God, I think the idea of Jesus is great, but none of it seems to resonate strongly. Our conversation got cut short, probably to be continued, but in the mean time, it feels good to have this weight off my shoulders. It feels good, even though I feel like I have entered new territory and I have no clue where this road leads.
Thanks for all your comments. It is nice to read the stories of others.
It’s late Saturday night/early Sunday morning. I spent the evening trying to prepare my lesson for the deacons tomorrow. This month’s topic is all about the apostasy/restoration. I looked over the lessons available & didn’t feel I could teach any of them honestly. I tried looking at them creatively, but none of it sits well with me. I really feel like it is time to step down as the 2nd C in the YM. Anyone have any advice stepping down without bringing undue attention to yourself or your family?
DBMormon wrote:Old-Timer wrote:I only shave because my wife won’t kiss me if I don’t – and I’d rather kiss my wife than have a beard.
Different motivations for different people.
Same Boat here!!!! her kisses mean way more then my wanting to support my laziness.
Funny how different all wives are. I have an unruly beard/moustache right now, but never hear a complaint. I figure it is because I was sporting beards on and off while we were dating. She knew what she was getting into, so now I have free reign.
I think the same can be said for my ward. I came into the ward with a Fu Manchu, followed by a beard shortly after. They knew early on what kind of heretic moved into their ward.
Thanks for all of you responses so far, I guess where I need to start is with the desire to believe. I want to stay, but after conference I felt totally discouraged. I just can’t put a finger on why I should stay. I believe there is a lot of value in the earlier comment about separating the baby from the bathwater, but I am still looking for the baby. My wife has told me she doesn’t care if I stay in or not. My social scene is entirely outside of the church so that isn’t the baby we are looking for. I guess I need to try and connect with something on a spiritual level. I know that is the most important part anyway, but if that fails, then there really isn’t anything left. This past year has really been a roller coaster.
I think the church only had power regarding issues like this if you let them. Beards, colored shirts, pants for women, it’s all the same. My beard is getting longer and my hair might be a bit shaggy. People make ignorant comments to me so I am sure they also say things when I am not around. But if I give in to their dress codes and standards then they win. I didn’t grow my beard as a statement, but I chose not to shave it off as one. Roy wrote:
What if everything that JS did was 50% divine inspiration and 50% bold speculation? Would it still be worth it? What percentage of JS teachings must be from God before it tips the balance for you? One interesting thing is that for me the answer varies depending on the costs of membership. I am willing for it to only be 50% as long as there is a net gain and the church helps my family more than it hurts it. When the demand side of the equation includes crossing the frozen plains, losing family members to starvation and exposure, or making myself a “living sacrifice” in a plural marriage – then the percentage of certainty needs to be much higher…98%, 99%, 100%.I agree, it is pretty easy for me to find net gain in the church currently, as I can somewhat control what I put into it and I am comfortable with the returns based on that level of sacrifice. I believe that there was divine inspiration behind JS and that he was an overall influence for good. At this point, if I were to have to sacrifice my life, family, more money, beard (jk…sort of) then I would have to reconsider the net gain and have to think about the importance of this ‘guru’ in my life. For now, I don’t see any better options. I am not totally ready to turn it over to my guru within.
Amen on the investigator comments. Referring to people as members/non-members also drives me nuts, it is as if we are declarin their social value. As for the tradition of using brother/sister, that one has never been a comfortable one for me. I see it as a sign of respect between youth and adults, but not a necessary term. When an adult adressses me as brother… instead of Ian it feels very impersonal. Like they don’t remember my first name or something, or that they just aren’t comfortable enough around me to use it.
wuwei wrote:But the biggest issue for me is the way the SP told him he was wrong and to fast and pray himself into compliance.
Exactly.
It is kind of like my brother proposed to me. Do you think if Joseph prayed enough that maybe he could of convinced himself to let Martin Harris take the plates? If you try to convince yourself of something long enough you will believe it. Brainwashing?
Sent from my GT-I9100M using Tapatalk 2
