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Work on what makes you a better person and finding new things that do the same. Focus on movement, not desired outcome. Mormonism teaches eternal progression – so there is no need to rush.
This is exactly what I needed to hear. Thanks for the support. My EQP feels the Church should help me. At least I have friends who help me and listen to my plight. I will work on myself and keep a distance from those who bring me down within the Church.
Not surprised. The Church is wealthy and led by a lot of wealthy people. Every Bishop I had was successful in business and life. I just feel bad for the poor who scrape by on the widows mite. Tithing is a lot, sending missionaries is expensive. Need I say more. :clap: I agree with a lot of what you stated here. The come worship with us for Christmas (Sunday before Christmas)infomercials are terrible since other local churches generally go all out on Christmas services. Our ward is barely mustering up a choir, and we are not ready in the least. I know members in my area that go to midnight mass since the music is spectacular.I definitly need to move, but no until my high schoolers get through. Church is not too central in their lives, like it was for me when I was their age. I just strongly disdain LDS culture. I see how I wasted much of my life, trying so hard to be a goody-goody, and for what? I should have focused on making a buck and a avoiding the agony of Church culture. Socioeconomics is what life is all about. I worked hard with kids in Title I schools. Their future is quite bleak. Oh well. I guess I’m just pointing out the obvious. The Church has gone the way of internationalism, and corporation empire building. Since the Church continues to grow in Africa and South America, it will always thrive of its basic, highly controlled message with cookie-cutter Elders and Sisters to deliver it. Meanwhile the hard working middle class pays the bill through tithes and offerings. I see the Church as a Kingdom or Empire. Your tithing is 10% an income tax to pay your membership dues. Beside the Temple, and the meetinghouse, I dont know what more you get. I am supposed to minister presumably to people who dont pay their 10%. Why should I? I put more into the kingdom, have a Church calling, and make less income. The Kingdom is very hierarchical, central command in the Bishop. He dictates, he orders, he judges. I’ve learned if you have any suggestions, or opposing view points you keep them to yourself to avoid any backlash, especially if you are an outsider and say in my old ward this is what they did, etc. Need a hiatus from Church, or a new ward. Just bought the home so I need to wait it out. Forgot to mention, the Elders Quorum was a take over by the High Priests in my ward, to further suppress the rising generations. No council meeting ever takes place. The young guys keep quiet for the most part. My fifth Sunday was on family history getting names ready for the temple and yes, completing your 4 generations. My great grandparents had their 4 generations done, so now I have either most of the easy work done, and now I have too many temple names since I am working cousin lines. I think my ward gave up on the missionary work since we have not had a Convert baptism for the two years I have lived here. I laughed at the chili in the summer, and they shot down my hot dog idea. Lol. I think the problem with the church is the top down approach. Why not ask members what are you reservations for inviting your friends. My answer would be: who wants to be treated like crap, while paying 10% of their income? When the marginalized feel this way, they actually envy the non members who convey happiness, family values, and a care free attitude, and sense of community without church. Awesome neighbors who share and care with no strings attached. Reciprocate that love and there is no onerous obligation, just cooperation and mutual respect. I have 2 sons that I would like to go on missions. I hope I’m in a more affluent ward when it takes effect. I notice that very few young men from poor families are going on missions. I dont know whether they feel out priced, and would rather focus on their lives by going to school. I understand the cost going up, but realize the church has money. Is as disappointed that it is going up. I guess parents will work two extra jobs to see it happen. I feel that the chruch disdains and estranges a man’s man. Working class men that are rough around the edges are not accepted in Mormon culture. At times I would like to deck half of the Elders quorum with their weak pithy responses and attitudes. I get sick and tired of hearing men say how much better their spouse is than them, and they don’t know where they would be without them. My ex-wife is in hell (figuratively speaking) and lost custody of all of her children, even the one’s she had out of wedlock with partners after me. How could I relate to such a pathetic comment. Some people are more spiritual than others, and more righteous irregardless of their gender. The whole political correctness of gender outside the church has tainted the church as a whole. Evangelicals have better books on men being men of Christ than the True Church. Men are just told to love their wives and honor their Priesthood. I see women in Utah enabled to the point that when their spouse dies, they are unable to do hardly anything. What did these women do all day? Pathetic. D. Todd Christofferson gave a talk about men in the church. I think it came 5 years too late. I do not think it is a great topic to discuss since we are in a society that is more gender neutral. I can change diapers, do laundry, cook, and clean, do crafts just as good as women I know, if not better than some. Be a great person, and strive to excel at all things irregardless of gender stereotypes. I told the relief society recently when my wife was hospitalized. I appreciate the meals because it allows me time to visit my wife without having to stress out over another thing to do. I told the RS president. I can cook just fine, but I just do not have the time when I am working hours of overtime, and need to attend to other duties. I think the RS President thought I could not cook at all, and what men cook? Once again a gender stereotype entered the equation. Quote:he topic came up in stake council last evening. The original concern expressed was that people the missionaries are teaching no longer have their own class and feel kind of lost and maybe overwhelmed in the large class sizes all of our wards are seeing now and the experience is therefore less personal for them. The question was asked if there could be a second class. The SP replied that in the training her got from the area presidency they were very emphatic about not having a separate class for those taking discussions or new members.
I had no idea that they did away with gospel principles class. I saw a large amount of people the first Sunday that the new curriculum was employed, but now I fear that the new converts, or those who do not like big crowds will just decide not to attend Sunday school. I think gospel essentials was a great class for a small group to interact and learn the doctrines, or principles of the gospel and be able to ask questions without fear.
Another sad result of the new “radical” change.
Wonderful. I got sleep in and still be home for lunch at a decent hour. I believe this may work to attract new members and keep people in church. One less hour for members of the church to interact with each other, except for the brother in my ward that had an extra hour on Sunday to tick me off on Facebook with his bigoted pro Trump posts. Perhaps that brother should have to endure a third hour. Lol. To everyone that wrote I appreciate what you have said. Lately I’ve been feeling a little down. I got my Ministry assignments. I have 8 people that I have to visit, or email, or pray over, ordo something for, and I’m not that excited about it. I guess I will just try to do my best and try to put in the time. amy J wrote: Quote:I also make sure to note that I consider myself a Christian and apply Christian principles in my life in my conversations. Mostly because 1) I believe I am a Christian (Mormon subset) 2) most people I meet consider themselves Christian as well so it is common ground
This is where I start when ever discussing religion with any other denomination of Christian. Otherwise, I will try to build on common ground. I am trying to focus on the gospel of JC more than the Church as an institution. This helps me to (1), focus on what is at the core of my values and principles, and (2) Build on common beliefs that I hold with other Christians. On Saturday I had a Spanish discussion with Jehovah’s Witnesses who knocked on the door. I spoke to them candidly and openly about what I disagreed with them on and why. But, we left the conversation agreeing on many things, that Jesus would return, and that the millennium would take place on this earth that God’s children would inherit, but I think I confused them when I stated that it would be elevated to a Celestial sphere at the end of the 1,000 years. I realized that my scriptures were correct, I just could not remember chapter and verse like I did when I was on a mission. I enjoyed testifying that Christ has redeemed my soul and that those who believe in Christ and serve him would be saved, and become like God and inherit all that he has since his possessions are infinite. They challenged me on exaltation although I backed it up with the book of Revelation, but did not mention the doctrine by name. I candidly disagreed with them about the 144,000. I asked them if they were among the 144,000? I indicated that we have one thing agreed, that none of us could say we were among the 144,000, but I reminded them it was a representative number of 12,000 high priests, 12,000 from each tribe and it was not the maximum amount of people that would be saved.
But I tried to focus on Christ, the Church he established with 12 apostles and apostolic authority and that revelation directs his church just as Peter received revelation in the Bible. I almost segued into the Church, but by then we ran out of time, and I told them I enjoyed our conversation, but they did not need to “wast time with me” but should go see pagans and hypocrites and preach to them. I wanted to end there since I just moved to the area, and I am sure they would return since we did not contend.
Thanks guys for sharing. I have almost been away from this site for several months and I am glad I have this support forum to vent. I will probably just move on from it shake the guys hand like nothing ever happened, it was just one of those moments that totally rubbed me the wrong way; it brought back the negativity that I experienced in my old ward from more than one member and it just jolted me enough to be a little miffed. But, its a new year and I got 364 days to work on keeping my cool and planning some great comeback phrases for similar moments that I am sure will arise. Such as: The First Presidency approved the hymnbook and the Bishop is in charge of this ward take it up with them, and don’t bother me about it.
The sad thing is I have found my religious zeal diminish since my days as a missionary. I realize that the Church “turns off” many great people and almost seems to be opposite the life Christ in the New Testament as he was very open to other people but disdainful to the religious elites. I believe Pharisees are very alive and well in Mormonism and any other religion for that matter. I know at one time I was one of them. I used to look forward to General Conference, but know I see it as a day off from Church.
I used to look forward to studying the Scriptures, but once I realized how the seminary teachers of the church are directed to teach, I really don’t like to study works that I am so far removed from culturally. I feel that the Church restored by J.S. is very different from the Church that Brigham Young led. D&C is not taught to well and it almost seems like a glorified gospel principles class without much discussion of the church’s history.
I do my calling since the bishop cannot release me until I move out of the ward, I am doing better and getting along with those I work with, but I do not enjoy the feigned membership that doesn’t talk to me now that I am not assigned as their family to home teach.
I appreciate what you have written, and I know a lot of it has to do with my midlife crisis, but I don’t like the “all or nothing” approach that is taught in the church it is harmful to individuals and to families, and isolates many people from the secular culture.
Quote:I do think the church will probably part with scouting. And I think this would be accelerated by Monson passing away given how much of a scouter he was.
I totally agree. I am an Eagle Scout, but feel it is time for the Church to part from Scouting. I have some friends in Bishoprics; a Bishop and a counselor that hoped that the Church would just “can” scouting and do it’s own program. My friend ran the Friends for Scouting drive and he stated that all he wanted was to try to get the quota, and that he hates scouts and feels that the youth are better served by doing Young Mens/Young Womens and participating in sports or some other community activity or club that involves people or other faiths.
I was fortunate to have been in a very diverse scout troop with an Israeli, and Jehovah’s Witness, Catholics, Protestants, and some boys that later became gay. Scouting was great when we had a lot of participation, parental help, and great diverse youth. Now, I feel it is hard to get kids motivated, or parent’s to even help. I have helped with camp outs, but see it as a burden since usually time needs to be requested off to participate. I see scouts fizzling out eventually. Time will only tell.
