[LDSThomas]

Shades of Grey wrote:

This felt very sincere and captured my attention, thank you! Even if it’s not my experience exactly I can use this as a frame work for my own imaginary back and forth letter to/ from my organizational church “love”, that is at times strained (both ways).. but is always worth an honest internal dialouge such as this.

Shades of Grey:

Glad you found this helpful. I have been encouraged by the responses I’ve received here and elsewhere online — and the feedback I’ve gotten has helped me to put some things into perspective a bit better. If I truly love the church I will/must/want to find a way to forgive her (and her people) for her “mistakes” (real or perceived) and focus on the mutually beneficial time we’ve had together — and the good times we’ll have in the future.

The truth is, I do love many things about the church and the gospel message — and I think (and hope) that this is just a short-term lover’s quarrel, rather than a journey that will lead to divorce court.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

SunbeltRed wrote:

Hi everyone,

I don’t know yet how the middle-path will be, what obstacles we will encounter, but I feel happy that I can be me, unsure, unknowing, but willing to learn, and chart my own spiritual course.

Looking forward to connecting with the community.

-SunbeltRed

SunbeltRed:

Welcome! Many here are on the same type of path — no two of us exactly the same. Although it is not without some difficult days/weeks, I would not trade my new “Mormonism My Way” approach to life for the inauthentic approach I took in the past.

I look forward to getting to know you and reading your future posts.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

Welcome! Lots of good, wise folks here. You’ll fit right in!

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

SGoodman wrote:

Imagine how difficult it must be for Kate Kelly, Her husband and parents, and her Bishop and Stake President. My heart goes out to them and they figure prominently in my prayers.

SGoodman:

It is a difficult week for me BECAUSE it is a difficult week for all those you mentioned — as well as for me personally for my own reasons sort-of stated in the original post.

I believe that each of those you mentioned are in nearly impossible situations this week — I feel deeply for each of them. And for me. And for my church. And for my 4 amazing daughters, who will inherit whatever this week bestows on those who come after it.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

SGoodman wrote:

Dear LDS Thomas,

I’m so sorry you feel this way. I, too, remember vividly the euphoria of those early years together. You were committed and eager, though inexperienced. We did a lot of good together for a lot of people. I remember how scared you were when I first started calling you Bishop and how you grew into that role. When it was time for you to be released you were sad to have to step aside.

I was surprised to hear you ask “what have you done for me lately?” and to hear you say “you only call on me when you need something.” I’ve only ever called on you when something was needed but it has never been that I needed something. It was always to enlist you in helping your brothers and sisters, whether members or not. I don’t need a clean chapel, but your brothers and sisters appreciate Sunday all the more in a clean environment. I don’t need your home teaching but the Walkers do and Sister Perkins really does, especially this month.

“What have you done for me lately?” I had to rewrite this part a couple of times because I didn’t want it to sound condescending or accusatory. I just want to answer in simple terms and remind you of some of the things I’ve done for you. I taught you how to pray. I introduced you to your Father and to your Savior. I taught you the meaning of life and how you might live it more fully. I taught you to see your life in the context of eternity so that your actions and decisions might have greater meaning. And I reinforce those lessons for you on a daily basis so that you can experience a complete conversion and have what Jesus promises in Ezekiel 36:26. “A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.”

I envisioned a much longer relationship for us, you and I. There is so much we could yet accomplish and I so want to do those things with you rather than without you.

Love, The Mormon Church

P.S. You probably noticed that this letter never addressed priesthood and blacks, first visions, godhood, or Katie Kelly and John Dehlin. These are certainly issues but the main issue here is our relationship, yours and mine. Once that’s ironed out the rest of these questions practically answer themselves.

SGoodman:

Thanks for the care and concern that went into your response. Some of the things you mentioned in the 3rd paragraph are EXACTLY the reasons I stay — because I DO remember the “happier times” and the way my life has been blessed as a result of my membership in the church.

This week is a difficult week for a church member like me. Your email on behalf of my potentially estranged love is welcome and helpful.

Thanks,

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

amateurparent wrote:

LDSThomas:

Thank you for putting those feelings into words. As I read, I wanted to stand up and shout, “And ME too.”

LDSThomas, you captured my thoughts so well. Thank you.

— Amateur Parent

THANKS AGAIN to EVERYONE who has read and responded. Amateur Parent, it’s especially good to hear from you!

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

THANK YOU everyone for the continued kind comments. As I wrote the original “Dear Mormon Church” letter yesterday, I felt a little bit of peace and I thought that posting it would provide . . . I don’t know, something that I was apparently seeking. While the kind comments here (and on one other online space that I posted it) bring me some feeling that I am not alone, I continue to feel alot of anxiety today about it all. It is not a good feeling.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

DarkJedi wrote:

Nice, and I could certainly had written most of it myself. I’m not sure if we should be blaming the “Church” for the events of the past couple weeks, though. I say that because I spent many years being angry at God until I finally realized it wasn’t God I was or should have been angry with – it was the church. THEN, I realized it wasn’t the church, either – it was individuals in the church who had done the damage in the name of the church. And while I realize these individuals were wrong, I only realize it through the lens of my new-found faith and belief, and I realize they don’t know they’re wrong. (It really is sort of like the “Sixth Sense” thing.)

DJ:

Thanks for your comments. I am not exactly sure who my letter to my former love, the Mormon Church, is actually directed to — the members, SLC leaders, local leaders, the culture, or just my own memories of who I once was — because I, too, am the Mormon Church.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

hawkgrrrl wrote:

Really nice.

Thanks. I feel better knowing someone is listening.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

Keth wrote:

Hi. I’m Keth. I’ve been very confused for a long time. I feel like I’ve been going back and forth on staying and going. Every time I try to leave it is just so painful and I can’t do it. And then when I go back to church it is often very frustrating. Sometimes I have to leave a class so I won’t say something I’ll regret. I just don’t know what to do.

Hey, Keth. Welcome. You are among like-minded friends here. Hope you will feel welcome.

For me, I’ve chosen to do Mormonism “my way” and it works for me. Some Sundays are still frustrating, but I try to remember the big picture on those days. Not always easy, but doable. Whatever you choose and wherever you land, I wish you the best.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

I followed all the responses to this thread as they were posted and just wanted to say “thanks” to everyone for the terrific responses. It is great to be amongst so many thoughtful and inspiring people. I am strengthened by many here who find ways to make it all work. I find myself re-reading posts here frequently, especially when I need to remember why staying LDS is the best option for me (which I believe it to be).

So, again, THANK YOU for the great ideas.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

khakari wrote:

By the Blue Pill I’m referencing The Matrix. If I knew then what I know now,I would have remained in my blissful state of ignorance and enjoyed the rest of my life. Well, if I were mentally whole, that is. I suppose the crux of my crisis is due to Bipolar I Disorder. The story is so long and painful, I wonder if it’s even worth sharing again,

Khakari:

Welcome. I can certainly understand not wanting to tell a long and painful story over again, but I can tell you that many here would be interested to hear it. And would learn from it, I’m sure. Bipolar disorder is so complicated and so misunderstood by those who have no experience with it. I think so many members of the church (including bishops and other leaders) don’t understand it and as a result don’t know how to interract with or know how to comfort or mourn with those affected — including families. I hope your journey brings you peace.

What did you think about Elder Holland’s talk on depression/mental illness in the last gen conference?

Glad you are here.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

pentium3 wrote:

He even said ‘If Satan were here, he would be in a white shirt and tie, quoting what he has heard from other and telling us all the things we need to do to be saved…we don’t do things to be saved because we have already been bought with a price’ He said we spend a lot of our time teaching our kids works..that we forget to teach them to love Christ, and when we love Christ, we want to follow his example and we will naturally be more charitable, forgiving etc..

Amen! (And, this is EXACTLY why I almost never wear white shirts anymore to church!) Seriously, what a great message. I don’t do things to be saved, I do things because I am saved — or at least that’s the hope of my faith, such as it is.

pentium3 wrote:

flaming introvert

Me, too. Awesome phrase — can I steal it? Should we start a club?

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

Daeruin wrote:

My question is this. What do you personally think the consequences are of not being sealed? Is there some perspective on this that might ease my dear TBM wife’s fear of being separated in the hereafter?

I do not know the consequenses eternally of NOT being sealed. . . . and I don’t know what perspective would ease your wife’s fear of not being sealed. . . . and I know this ins’t exactly what you asked, but my response is — get your butt to the temple and get sealed — not for you (since you said it’s not too important to you), for your wife. Of course, I say that assuming that you don’t have to make any major lifestyle changes (but perhaps even if you do). Hey, I’ve seen nearly every dang chick flick movie that’s been made in the last 20 years cause that’s what my wife wants to see — same principle. The things we do for love . . . .

Seriously, I know you asked important questions and I’ve responsed in a less than serious way — but I think if it’s important to your wife and it’s something you can do, it would be a wonderful gesture and in her heart and mind you will be closer — which is the most important thing.

LDSThomas

[LDSThomas]

EuSouScott wrote:

Going to the temple is as painful sometimes as sitting through a fast and testimony meeting. I wish it could be more like I imagined it would be when I was young. Instead, it’s just a really quiet church building where you get all dressed up in white, watch a really long and boring movie, and then miss out on the best part because you are stressed out about the babysitter and have to run home.

I didn’t have primary-influenced expectations. I converted to the church in college and went to the temple about a year later, before my mission. I remember 2 friends (other than missionaries) talking to me about the temple before I went and what to expect. (I had seen the Godmakers on video — way before the internet — so I had an idea of some of the temple mechanics).

One friend talked about it using words like “special” and “spiritual” and “wow” and all that. The other friend was more liberal on history/doctrine/etc even before the internet and what I remember him telling me was “Try not to laugh out loud when you think about how everyone is dressed and all the movements, OK? Especially when you are standing all together in a circle near the end.” Both of these friends were faithful LDS, with obviously different perspectives. My temple experiences have been both “special” and comical. And, I think about my friend’s advice not to laugh every time I have gone even all these years later. And, I don’t laugh (out loud).

I am very realistic about the temple with my kids — one has already gone to the temple pre-mission. My main message is — it’s almost all symbolic so don’t take it too literally, you won’t see angels walking around in the hallways as some people like to imply, it’s very different than Sundays at church, and you might like it and you might not — everyone has a different experience. And, you probably won’t have some revelation about some deep mystery every (or any) time you go. Most temple workers are nice, but a few are sometimes are grumpy! I am detailed about all the mechanics, only leaving out the very specific things I’ve promised not to discuss. (Cause it’s secret and sacred). I also tell them it’s a great place to put “the world” aside and focus on eternity, the things that matter to you most, and to meditate. I tell them I’ve had good experiences there and I’ve had uneventful experiences (and even boring experiences when I wasn’t “feeling it”) — and they will probably have a range of experiences, too.

My approach with my children has been to manage expectations to be more realistic than what they might hear from well-meaning teachers at church. I would rather them not be let down by the first visit and “grow” into the idea of what the temple experience is all about. It’s worked for the oldest child. We’ll see how it works with the others.

LDSThomas

[Author]

Posts