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I know I’m very late to this particular party and I hardly ever post here anymore, but I just had to say that I’ve loved reading this thread. It’s always good to know that I’m not alone in the way I feel about the temple. Ray wrote:It’s okay to reduce or even eliminate things that feel like getting punched in the face constantly, especially if doing so allows you time and space to find ways to make it stop feeling that way. For example, using the exact reference to movies, if the endowment presentation currently exacerbates your anger quotient and makes you feel like you are being punched in the face, it’s okay to not “particularly want to see it”.
Thank you for this insight Ray. When I talked with my mom about me and my family not currently attending church, she was very insistent that I give her a “good” reason. Not wanting to make anything worse between us or open any of the historical cans of worms, I simply told her that for me, right now, attending church is not mentally or emotionally healthy. It “exacerbates my anger quotient” so to speak. That she could understand. I haven’t ruled out attending again one day, but I don’t see myself attending the temple, at least not endowments or sealings. A lot of people talk about taking the good and leaving the bad. I’ve finally made peace with the fact that it is okay that the endowment and sealings are part of the bad for me individually.
I voted yes because that’s what we are doing. Dh and I and our kids don’t attend anymore. I was talking to DH last night and mentioned how I could probably attend occasionally and still be a member (just not an orthodox one) if it was just me to consider. However, like mackay is experiencing, my children were being taught the very orthodox version of the church and trying to undo the damage being done was exhausting. I’m missing the sense of community, but I don’t think I could go just for that aspect. Before we stopped attending altogether I tried going just to RS by myself a few times and found it hard to take mentally and emotionally. We have yet to experience the fallout of our decision with extended family, but that will be happening soon. I like what Ray mentioned about it coming down to personal choice. I can understand and respect the choice of others to stay and I hope they will respect our choice not to.
My mom was a big time believer that tithing is what keeps you temporally taken care of. She always paid tithing first, even when she didn’t have enough to pay basic bills. We ate a lot of food from the bishop’s storehouse growing up, but my mom never missed paying her tithing. So when I got married and started my family, that notion was always there. DH’s parents are very adamant about it that way too. So we would pay our tithing first, even if it meant we couldn’t pay other bills. I guess I thought that as long as we were doing what God had asked us to do (pay tithing), we would be taken care of. I was raised on the stories of paying tithing even though you need to fix your vehicle so you can get to work and care for your family and then suddenly some miracle would occur like the repair was no longer needed or someone would offer to do it for free, etc. I always paid our tithing first, even when we were struggling financially with one small income and three small children. Now that I no longer believe, I feel that God would want me to care for my family first and then donate to worthy causes or people as I am able. Kumahito wrote:May, if you’re comfortable telling me, what state are you moving out of? Depending on what state you’re currently resident in, there may be standard landlord-tenant legislation that would be in your favor.
We’re moving out of Utah.
DarkJedi wrote:Glad it worked out for you – you have a lot on your plate right now.
Yes, DarkJedi. Yes I do. DH is already at the new place working and I’ve been left to pack/take care of the kids/make all the moving arrangements, etc. I also have my 2 graduate classes to keep up with as well. Thank goodness the move will be over in a few days!
Well, the pm company solved the dilemma for me. I asked them for options and they gave me 3. Find someone to move in by Dec 1st to finish the last month of the lease as well as sign a new 12 month lease, stay and pay, or move out now and forfeit our security deposit. We’re taking option #3. I feel much better doing it now that they’ve actually said we can. Besides, I looked at the list of things they check and deduct for after move-out and I doubt we’d get any deposit back anyway. Phew! That’s one worry off my shoulders. Now on to the other million.
Thanks for your thoughts. It’s good to hear other peoples’ experiences and opinions. SD- it sounds like you would be a great landlord! We had a wonderful one for almost 6 years at the place we lived previously. He personally owned and maintained the home. I think that makes a difference. He was very willing to work with us on funds when my husband got a job transfer over 300 miles away and we had to move quickly. He knew all our kids, our dog, we made him cookies on holidays…
Dealing with property management companies who are simply managing the properties for a group of investors is completely different. They don’t care about your personal situation at all. Personally, I think it was a bit cold of them to immediately raise the rent on all the units. For some families, it was an increase of $150/month. Then they demanded new one-year leases from all tenants who are currently month-to-month and only gave them 2 weeks to decide whether they are staying and signing or moving out by Dec. 1st.(30 days after the decision deadline) These are big decisions happening for real families! It’s just basically been, “do it our way or move out!” I understand they have the right to do that, I just don’t think they did it very tactfully. Our friend in another unit has been waiting for them to send someone out to fix her dishwasher for over a month. They’ve just really rubbed me the wrong way. I also agree that they probably would give us very little, if any, of our initial deposit back no matter what we do.
Thanks for being my sounding board guys. I’m so stressed out right now, you wouldn’t believe it. The kids have school and other activities this week, I have an exam this weekend as well as an interview assignment to complete, and I’m the one doing all the packing. DH will get here late Friday night, we load up the truck Saturday morning. Add to that the fact that I’m still really apprehensive about this move and dreading living where we’re going to be living and I’m just a mess.
I’ve had issues with depression off and on my whole life, but I didn’t get to the point where I felt I couldn’t handle it alone until after my 4th child was born. That’s when it got scary. I was battling my usual postpartum depression, plus my shelf crashed and burned just a little over a month after I gave birth. I also have anxiety issues, but again, not many until the last year. I now take medication daily for the depression and things are so much better. I’ve found talking to a therapist to be very helpful as well. Yep, crazy as they come! 😆 I agree completely. So many instances in my life, not only religious, this has applied. When I first started learning new and surprising things about the church and church history I got very angry. That was kind of my first reaction. I think it’s that way with a lot of things. But now I do feel more free. Old-Timer wrote:Be a good Visiting Teacher by providing what she needs and wants. Period. Tell your leaders that you are happy to visit with her and will do your best to share the Gospel with her, then report back to your VT Coordinator or RS President that she is doing well, accepting your visits but has no desire whatsoever to come back to church right now. Tell them that she is grateful you are her Visiting Teacher. Tell them that you will continue to visit her and will let them know if that changes in the future. Ask them to let you be her Visiting Teacher for as long as it takes – knowing it might not ever happen but that you are better for her than someone else. If the assignment changes at some point, keep visiting her regularly simply as a friend.
Ray put it perfectly. I’m glad they got it right by assigning her to you and not someone who would be insensitive to her needs and situation.
Hi Brokenfaith. You’ve already gotten plenty of wonderful advice from the wonderful people here at StayLDS. I just want to add my voice to theirs in saying that you’re not alone. Those three points (temple, tithing, garments) were difficult for me as well. Currently, I don’t attend the temple, wear garments, or pay tithing. Right now, I can’t see myself ever doing those things again, but I also don’t know what the future will bring and that’s okay. I don’t have to have all the answers right now.
Like you, I’m seeing a therapist and that has been very helpful to me in this area and others in my life. Your journey is yours alone. Trust yourself to make the right decisions and to have the ability to know what is best for you.
I enjoyed reading this Ray. Despite our earlier decision, we’re still kind of floundering along. We’ll be making our move soon and have yet to decide how involved, if at all, we want to be. Being Mormon is hard. Being a StayLDS kind of Mormon is even harder. Thank goodness for people like you and sites like this to give us comfort and support. Thanks guys. I think the one-thing-at-a-time approach is probably the best. I don’t post much at all on FB or other social media and I definitely don’t post about religion. I don’t think FB is the place for that. I also agree with DarkJedi that my mom probably noticed a lot more than I thought. She even mentioned not seeing an Ensign or Friend magazine anywhere in our house. So, she’s probably figured out that something’s up. I’ll just continue having those conversations with her as needed and take things slow.
Hopefully things can progress that way with the in-laws as well. I kind of doubt it though. GodIsLove, I think our in-laws sound very much alike. They were very unhappy with DH marrying me because I come from a divorced family with a gay brother. They didn’t really warm up to me at all until I had their first grandchild. They’re very orthodox and aren’t afraid to preach when they feel you’re going astray. I think we’ll just take the same approach though and they’ll have to deal with it.
I really struggle with #2. In regards to my changes in faith this past year, I’m constantly worried about what others will think and how they will feel about my decisions and actions in this area, especially my family. Hi Southern. It’s great to hear from you. I’ve been wondering how you’re doing. As others have mentioned, I think insisting on being present for all interviews is your right as a parent and shouldn’t cause any problems. My 9 year-old son wanted to attend a temple dedication this past year and had to have an interview with a member of the bishopric. I went with him. The counselor doing the interview went through the questions and I was caught off guard and bit surprised to hear him ask my son “Do you obey the law of chastity?” My son just looked at me like “What on earth is that?!” I gave a very brief, age-appropriate definition and we glossed right over it. I’m glad I was there though. I’m glad to hear that you and your husband are doing better and using your faith transition to become closer and stronger. Best of luck!
I’ve lived in Utah my entire life. Now that I’m transitioning out of the church, I totally over analyze every interaction I have with neighbors, family and friends who are TBM. I worry about them realizing I’m not wearing garments or asking me why I’m missing so much church lately. Overall though, these worries have been completely unnecessary. There are things about Utah now that bother me a lot that didn’t before. I can see how it would be very hard to move back here after living in another, more liberal and accepting place. Just continue to be yourself.
Orson wrote:my first thought is to first demonstrate similarities before revealing all your differences.
I think this is a great idea. There’s no need to broadcast your inactivity in the church. Yes, be honest if someone asks, but I wouldn’t bring it up. Just focus on meeting the neighbors and being friendly. I think you’ll find that people aren’t always as judgmental as we make them out to be in our minds.I’m sorry your visit from the bishop was unpleasant. Just try to remember that he’s doing the best he can. Maybe take things one day at a time. There are a lot of good things about living in Utah. Good luck!
