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Agreed. Things are changing now more than ever. As moderate young adults like myself stay in, we’ll spread our ideas more and things will continue to change. My generation will be the drivers of that. Hey University. I know how you feel about indecision about dating. I’m a mid 20s guy at BYU. The longer I go in my faith transition, the more perspective I gain on everything. Right now I’m at the point of, I can’t say I 100% believe in everything, but I hope for most of it, and that’s the basis of faith. God is probably ok with that and loves me anyways. If God lets such imperfect people lead us, he will surely be very merciful with us. It’s hard to think sometimes dating other people and having them accept that imperfection. We want to present that best face. I was in the same place as you, and didn’t want to put that burden on someone else. But now I think someone who can accept that imperfection and loves me for me, and understands my faith is just a part of me and not the determining factor to how good of a husband I will be is what I need. And that person will probably be more Christlike, and a better loving, understanding parent. And that’s what I want my kids to have too. I would say it’s easy to be frustrated and try to push people away because you feel different, or that they just don’t understand your doubts and pains. And that’s ok that they don’t. They don’t have to. But don’t give up everything else you have with those relationships just because they aren’t able to get that one part of you. Don’t feel like you need to casually date or do anything you don’t want to. The only timeline that you have is the one you set for yourself.
Don’t take it too fast. Don’t feel like you have to make a decision right now. You know that. But, it took Christ 30 years to really come to terms with who he was and his mission in life. Just a little perspective.
I feel you jamison. I’ve applied to probably 50 different jobs in the last few months, made it to the 2nd or 3rd interview on a few of them, and haven’t received an offer yet. I graduate next week and my family has that pressure on me to find something and just go to work but, we all know it doesn’t work like that. My advice, is that you find something that you can put some energy in that will give you some fulfillment. Learning something new in your spare time, exercising, or making and achieving some goals. That’s what I do, and that’s what helps me stay up. Keep up the hard work, you’ll make it.
mom3 wrote:Quote:aim for the ideal
I guess that means the next time the Olympics come around we should tell non-gold medal contenders to stay home.
if/maybe/when i have a daughter, i’ll be teaching her to aim for her ideal. whatever that looks like
From the very beginning of my faith crisis, I’ve come to the conclusion that God is much more forgiving than the viewpoint I had before hand; like many others here I had a very black and white view and I’ve transitioned into a “shades of grey” type view. Christ I think, is saying they don’t understand the severity of the action they’re committing- murder ? I watched this last night- it was one of the first times I’ve felt inspired to be a better person in a while, directly as a result of church oriented materials. Maybe the spirit I thought even. They’re called dermals. So you basically have a stud type jewelry piece sticking out, usually on your chest or back. I think they’re weird as hell. Also still YSA. What a tough place to be in, as a member of this forum and not 100% in but not out either. Honestly it’s one of my biggest challenges right now. I think it’s interesting there hasn’t been one doctrinal/church support.. just practical. Interesting to me how we are all on such a similar page. I think there are a lot of valid concerns- permanence being the major and consistent issue. I think we have an issue with things being “permanent”, especially after a lot of the changes we’ve had in our lives. I’ve toyed with the idea and, the permanence is the only thing that stops me, tastes changing, etc. It just doesn’t seem worth it. I wish there was a way to have longer term “temporary” ones. Mike wrote:In my younger days, I wanted a gnarly scar.
I used to want one- then I got a gnarly scar from that near death experience. Actually multiple- about a 10 inch scar from my knee to my ankle, and about another 10 inches from my neck/trap to the front of my delt and my bicep from consequential surgeries. Those weren’t worth it
Interesting- a lot of points I agree with. Primarily hawkgrrrl and everyone mentioning how they don’t hold up with age. I have a hard time with the same things over and over in terms of clothing/style, and the fact that they fade and lose quality. Is there anything actually doctrinal? Roy I actually pulled up that thread too, but it was a few years old and I wanted to see how peoples thoughts and views have changed since it was primarily the same people in that thread that I see posting now I was in a bad accident that probably almost killed me and left me partially disabled and I’ve been thinking about a way to commemorate that event. Not so much as a reason to rebel, just a way of expression I suppose.
I also think if I ever got married, it would be way easier to have a tattoo ring vs. a real ring because my knuckles aren’t ring friendly- had to cut the last one off that went on that ring finger
😆 nibbler wrote:Quote:Many historians insist such a shift is not only possible but also essential.
Agreed, but how do we shift? I’ll toss some ideas over the fence at the end of the post.
Quote:The answer isn’t to replace simplistic stories with footnoted essays. It is to tell better, more complete, stories, stories that are true, that touch issues people really care about.
Only being exposed to a whitewashed version of history robs us of our ability to relate to that history. We are human, the history that has been presented in the past is cast with caricatures, that makes it more difficult to relate to and it’s hard to learn life lessons when we can’t relate. Humans learn from both the good and the bad. How do we learn to apply gospel principles to our nuanced lives when the examples we draw on are not equally nuanced?
Quote:Others, both professors and students, told of stories whereby they drew upon the essay in church meetings and were met by resistance from fellow Mormons who said the essays were not official and merely [church] Public Affairs pieces.
This has largely been my experience. Some people did a little too good of a job in convincing themselves and others to fear anti Mormon half truths. We’ve taught people to fear information as opposed to teaching them how to process information.
Another problem we face, some people have built up a testimony on the whitewashed version of history. What happens when the rug is yanked out from under them? Losing trust in fallible people may be a good thing in the long run but they may run the risk of losing trust in their ability to feel the spirit (sound familiar?).
For instance, several months ago our PH quorum spent half of the class discussing justifications for the priesthood ban for black people. This also included personal testimonies of divine intervention during a PH ordination. God stepped in and forcibly prevented an ordination, no one knew why, come to find out the person being ordained had a great great grandfather with African ancestry. I can raise my hand and mention the essay but a lifetime of faith in the
leadersof the church coupled with personal witnessisn’t something that is going to be corrected during one lesson, besides… the things that created that testimony will trump correction from a class member. We talked about this when the essays were being released, they need more exposure. Exposure from people with more clout than well meaning local members. Some of Nephi’s plain and simple speaking on these issues would go a long way.
As far as the shift…
Focus less on church history. Church history is woven into every aspect of the correlated material, we’ve placed too much emphasis on church history. Examples of gospel principles come from scripture but many come from church history as well. I’d love to see more examples in our manuals of gospel principles being lived by people that come from outside Mormonism. It’s the principle that’s important. I think we’ve ended up with church history events that have been whitewashed until they fit the mold of a principle being taught. Why bother doing that when there are so many examples of principles in action that surround us. Our own church history is a gospel hobby that has been woven into the very fabric of all correlated material.
Focus less on the leaders. All the leaders should be doing/saying is pointing people in the direction of Christ.
Culturally we’ve asked members to develop testimonies of historic church events to establish the church’s truth claims. Culturally we’ve asked members to develop testimonies of the leaders. Those are sandy foundations.
I’m going to chime in and say I am one of those who thought I had a balanced testimony, but in reality had much more of a “testimony” of leaders than not, and the rug was indeed yanked from under me. There are so many people within my age group who are in my same position and I’m finding more and more every week. It’s relieving I’m not the only one, but also concerning because it’s so wide spread.
LDS_Scoutmaster wrote:I was going to start this post with “I think I’m in the best ward in the church”, but that’s just a fleeting thought as I know nothings perfect. But yesterday was really good, the youth speaker talked about not judging others, the adults gave excellent talks quoting from the Baptist hymnal and other sources (the concluding speaker was a sister as well). Really great meeting.
OTOH, there was a slight disturbance towards the end of the 3rd hour and the police showed up, so there’s that.
story please!
