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Katzpur, after your visit with the Stake President, please report back. It will be interesting what he has to say.
I agree with DJ. I joined the church in an area where there were few members much less single members my age. So, I did date nonmembers. It was interesting and we usually didn’t have much in common, so I moved on.
I found “M Men & Gleaners”. That was the single adults before they changed the name. (Yes, I’m old.)
I met my wife & the rest is history.
Personally, it depends on the question. If it has to do with worthiness or even the appearance, I wouldn’t answer the question. Fortunately, I haven’t been in that situation.
SilentDawning wrote:
I also struggle with JS’s practical motives. He clearly believed he was a prophet, and put a lot of effort into distributing his religion with the printing of the BoM, his preaching, and all he endured to bring forth the gospel.What are your thoughts on Joseph Smith? Do you believe he was a prophet? Or just someone who believed he was?
What are your thoughts on Joseph Smith?I’ve been thinking a lot about Joseph Smith lately. SD’s post encouraged me to document what I’m thinking. Or, try to at least.
This is an interesting person. This is a complicated person. Can you imagine trying to write a book that purports to document for history, the
life, travels & history of a people that lived anciently? And in the process, have this document survive 190+ years? This was in a time when
approximately 20% were literate. So, approximately 80% of the early converts believed based upon the testimony of others or the direct voice
of JS. Then over the next 190 years, the church will grow to over 17,255,000 people worldwide. Even if 50% were “true blue” & fully active,
the numbers are astounding to think about.
Do you believe he was a prophet?Or, just someone who believed he was?
My answer to both questions is yes. In my own simple way, I do believe. I am complicated in my belief.
I do not consider myself “true blue or fully active”. I am a rebel within a cause. If given the opportunity, I could (& would) argue any lesson,
talk or principle given at church. So, I remain silent. (Usually.)
Joseph is an interesting character in our common history. I would of loved to talk with him face to face.
Another connected issue is attendance at church. My own observations are very limited. They are related to my own ward only.
I don’t participate in any Stake activities including Stake Conference.
This past Sunday, I noticed that attendance at Sacrament meeting was reasonably full.
Priesthood & Sunday school have been fairly empty. By that I mean, less than half of the adults
from the Sacrament meeting. Even when you take into account the teachers in Primary, AP &
Relief Society, it was noticeable empty. This isn’t the first time I’ve noticed it.
Has anyone else noticed the same thing in your ward or branch?
Another topic I haven’t hear at church anymore it: Family History or Temple Work.
I wonder if that could be because when we do talk about it, it is difficult to make a connection to
Jesus Christ. And, we don’t want to break confidentially concerning what we do there. Yet on we
go building more temples.
This seems to be an interesting time to be living in the church. It feels like a time of transition.
We, as a church, seem to be moving into another phase but I don’t know why or where we’re going.
Myron, I think there are a lot of us that don’t understand why it’s wrong. The only conclusion I can come up with is that there are other issues that play into the history of why it was & continue to be forbidden. None of the reason had to do
with health issues. For example, political or economic?
I completely understand not using tobacco or alcohol. Even then, there are some who can argue that it should be a matter
of personal choice. But, as I understand it, even cold coffee or iced tea are included in the ban. Also, if it’s a matter of it
being a word of wisdom, maybe they should include being overweight in the temple recommend interview.
I like your point about your definition of a perfect day off.
Here are a few more… . No Personal Priesthood Interviews (PPI).
. No conversation in passing about the families I’m assigned. (Ministry Program).
. No discussion or instruction about Priesthood Ordinances anymore.
. I have no idea who our Elders Quorum President is.
If it wasn’t for JS & the BOM, it feels like I’m back in the Methodist Church.
This was an old post that I thought we should bring back. It is interesting how our faith transitions over time. Some of us are more open about it.
Others see openness as a weakness.
The main questions being asked is very interesting:
Quote:How far can you reinterpret LDS beliefs before you can no longer be considered LDS? Can you ever be outside the boundaries of the LDS church except by your own definition? (other than through resignation or church disciplinary action)There was a time when the Priesthood, had the following offices on a stake & ward level: – Elders Quorum.
– Seventies Quorum.
– High Priests Quorum.
They were smaller intimate groups that met every Sunday. Because we were together every week, we
got to know each other on a more personal level. We could ask questions that was maybe outside of the lesson
material. As a result, we would get to know each other & share facts about our lives that we just don’t do
today. The Elders quorum is big & the pressure is to strictly follow the program & the lesson prepared.
Since the organizational change, I rarely like to attend. If I do, I don’t participate.
The opportunity to share problems or explore solutions, is nonexistent.
Maybe I’m overly sensitive. But, I feel that something is lost.
Old-Timer wrote:
…I believe that is the primary hope of any group: to allow people to stumble in their own way while helping them back up and lessening the frequency and severity of their future stumbling.
Too often we (as a church) focus on the innocent children praying to find her toy or the evil Ted Bundy.
It is the middle of the population that seems alone to struggle with the challenges in their life.
They may find their own solution & we (as a congregation) miss out on how they did it.
We also miss out by not showing empathy or support.
I have known a number of people who are or were alcoholics. – some have struggled to come to terms with their addiction.
– some never did.
– some have joined AA or NA and found a fellowship, answers, support & strength.
As a result, they have come back to live a normal life.
One of my friends died this past week with 30+ years of sobriety.
He helped a lot of people along the way.
I think we can learn a lot from support groups like this.
In my mind, that is one of the functions of church. There is of course, the addiction recovery program.
That is a good start.
My point is: there should be more support, understanding & empathy for spiritual struggles.
The answers for these issues or problems aren’t always in the innocents of a child’s prayers.
It is in the personal connections we make with each other.
Stumbling in our journey through this life is not a weakness.
In my opinion, the church set the formula for how prayers are answered with the Joseph Smith story of the first vision. – A young man (or woman) goes to the sacred grove to pray & ask God a question. (Which church is true?)
– God answers his (or her) prayer.
– Then we send Missionaries to preach the gospel & challenge investigators to be baptized.
– We wait a week or two & God gives us an answer.
– We can’t be surprised when a child loses a toy then prays & he (or she) expects an answer right now.
Then, as adults we go through adult issues or problems & it seems to take longer to resolve or receive answers.
For example:
– A child has a terminal illness or injury.
– Couples get divorced.
– Missionaries die in the field.
– The list goes on.
Some of us never seem to receive an answer.
Some of us never even receive comfort in our grief.
Jesus even on the cross asks “why hast thou forsaken me?” (Matt 27:46)
The innocence of a child is nice & inspirational but, it isn’t always enough as an adult.
For me personally, it would be helpful to hear how others who have gone through difficult situations as an adult, and
come through the other side: to know how did they do that?
It has been sites like this that have given me a window to the other side.
AmyJ, I like the way you think. I know I make like far more complicated than it has to be. I’m sure that God is far more understanding than I give him credit for.
I know that this is a “left” turn from my own topic. Please be patient. Before my crisis of faith, I was 100% in. I lived the gospel as best that
I could. I answered the TR questions with complete honesty.
Today if I wanted a TR & go to the temple, I would feel dishonest & guilty
answering this question with a “Yes”.
The temple recommend interview questions include the following:
11.
Quote:Do you understand and obey the Word of Wisdom?
Because of being inactive for a period of time, I feel guilty about most gospel
teachings & beliefs. I’m not sure how to get through that issue in my life.
Here’s another “left” turn. I have a phantasy: Jesus Christ comes to sacrament meeting. He comes
to the podium carrying a Starbuck’s cup & starts his talk. How many people would be able to
concentrate on what He says & instead concentration on the cup of coffee in His hand?
I think a lot of times we are more interested in the appearance of holiness instead of judging ourselves or
others.
