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Very touching story. Very inspiring current view. You are a blessing to so many people. I think honesty with oneself is the most freeing action out there. I can see why it assists those with addictions. So generous on your part to share this. Thanks. Scott, Sounds like you are in a good place. I am glad for you that you were given the recommend and the time to sort things out and that you have been honest with your wife and Stake President. This is kind of what happened to me at first. As I got more certain and became uninterested in “wanting to know” as my Bishop put it, I was denied a Temple Recommend. Of course, that was 10 years after I saw things differently and 4 years after talking to a Bishop the first time and getting the advice you have gotten. I am happy with the way mine turned out. Most of my family now know about my views not matching those of the church. I still have two callings. I still go to Sacrament meeting every week with my family. The ward membership is very very slowly figuring out I am not quite as believing as some of them. This all is good for me. Perhaps you will have a completely different result as you attend the temple, read, study, and pray. May the peace you have now continue to buoy you up as you go through your life.
We are OK at the moment. Own one rental outright, our home is mortgaged pretty high. No consumer debt. Lots of Medical bills, never had so much in over 26 years. I may need to work. I havent worked full time for 10 years. I attempted to get a job today. No luck. I will keep searching. I will perhaps do a specific search among construciton companies as most of my experience is in job costing, payroll, and accounts payable in Construction. Not sure how construction companies are doing in my area. I would prefer to find a full time temporary position so I can pay off the medical debts in 4 to 6 months, then not work again. lots of kids still home and home educating still. A bit of a challenge AND I have done it before in bad times. Not too discouraged or worried or depressed. I figure if all goes badly we may lose this house and we can move into our rental. Not the end of the world. Lots of food in the house and know what to do with it. Lots of able bodied children to make do with what we have. I have had full faith and confidence in a major economic downfall for over 20 years and have never seen in reality what my mind has seen. So, I really am just plain ready anyday any time. Kinderhook08, Welcome. I think you will like it here. All are gentle and intentional about being at peace with what is so here, in the church, and in ourselves and families. In this case it seems that ignorance WAS bliss and you are no longer ignorant of historical information. May you have peace for the day, you are in a good place here. Godzilla Gaijin said, “I find the best way to beat down the jaded NOM in me whenever I hear somebody start to say “I KNOW that X is…” in church, is to subsitute “I love the sense of belonging that X gives me.” That reminds me of the first time I read a book by Mr. Rogers of Mr. Rogers’ Neighborhood. He said that instead of hearing “No” when a 2 yr old says “No” just hear ” I am an individual” That made a huge difference in my raising my kids. Thank you for sharing this view. Perhaps it will make a difference in my life.
I am reading a book called the Book of Myths by Joseph Campbell. There is quite a bit in there about the importance of myth and ritual. Perhaps that would be a way to look at it. For now I am done wth the whole business of the temple. No recommend, no temple attendence. I went only rarely before. I found that I was not happy there most of the time anyway. I was just doing my duty. I may change my view as I get closer to the end of the Myths book. I am half way through now and have at least had the thought that my mind MIGHT change later on. So, we shall see. Good luck with your choice and search and experience.
Holding JS to an impossible expectation reminded me of myself. I kept my issues around my spiritual life a secret from all but my husband for years. I have shared it only with two Bishops so far and will likely not attempt to share it again with anyone else in the next few years. It is as though it is better for all to keep quiet. OK OK I have shared a bit here too. grin Valoel, Would you name a few of the “ideas in eastern spirituality” that you alluded to in your post. I listen to Deepak Chopra, Gregg Braden, Alan Watts, and have studied a bit of Kaballah. My experience with Eastern Religions is very very limited. I would like to hear more of what you have experienced that once was part of the Christian tradition but has been lost. Thank you for sharing.
I read my husband Jordan’s reply and he said, “That is a great opening for that statement.” He was pointing at a quote that i have had hanging on my wall for a long time. It is from a book titled “A Return to Religion” by Henry C. Link copyright 1937. Here it is. My reason for attending church again is that I have recommended it to so many others.I go because I would rather lie in bed late on Sunday mornings, the only chance for a good sleep I have during the week.I go because I would rather read the Sunday papers.I go because I know it will please my old father, when he learns of it, and my parents-in-law whom I shall undoubtedly see there.I go because I shall meet and have to shake hands with people, many of whom do not interest me in the least;because, if I dont go, my children consider that they have a good reason for not going to Sunday School;because I might be asked to do something I don’t want to do;because I may disagree with what the minister has to say.I go because some of my best friends, who know the details of my life, consider me a hypocrite.I go because I do not believe in all the doctrines of this church, or any other church.I go in short, because I hate to go and because I know that it will do me good.page 19 I on my wall. I blew this up and have each reason highlighted in a different color on my wall. This guy was not LDS at all and never mentioned LDS anywhere in the book. I truly want to live up to that paragraph. Selfless and intentional.
I so get that I need to LOVE everyone, EVEN those at church.
I have only attended the Unitarian Universalist church as a search for a place for me to be free to seek my own path. I loved it there and I liked the songs and the members and the service. I may continue to visit there when my ward meets at a different time starting in January. I am not really looking for religion. I am looking for a place to love and be loved exactly as they are and exactly as I am with no shoulds or oughtas.
The belief-o-matic test had me 100% Unitarian Universalist. I was only 17% LDS. This was rather shocking actually. I did not realize how different my personal beliefs are from what I have surrounded myself with for over 32 years. I a happy with the people in my ward. I am happy with who my children are as a result of being brought up Mormon. I am sad that I did not find the UU church sooner. I really would have liked to raise my family in it AND I did not, so. I think I would have been happier during the first 17 years of my marraige. AND perhaps not. I was not who I am now back then so it might have never been a good match until now. I cannot and wil not attempt to uproot my kids from the LDS church so that they can “search” for their own path. That is the main benefit to the Unitarians is that they promote all continuing to progress in their own spiritual path all the while being doers and be-ers of the word not only hearers.
I will not be searching for any other religion. I will stay LDS and I will participate as much as possible with the UU. I live rather far from the UU also. Not very convenient.
Since I have home educated and home birthed and participated in Conservative politics over time I have trained my children more like Christian Fundamentalists than LDS. In fact when I took the Belief o matic test as if I were what I thought a TBM I showed up 99% Christian Fundamentalist and only 95% LDS. Pretty enlightening. Quaker was my second highest when sharing my current views. Interesting altogether.
Yes, Orson, I have. Only once though and need to listen again and again. I am just so far from wanting or needing to believe in the teachings of the church except that my integrity led me to tell the truth and now not have a recommend. The recommend for me was only for my children. Many of them are still left to be married and are expecting that I will be there. My current view is that I will NEVER believe in a way that I could in all integrity say yes to the first four questions of the TR interview. I have a secret hope that by some magic I will be able to once again say yes without being out of integrity AND without ignoring the truths I have discovered over the years. I simply would prefer to have my views and my relationship with the Universe and not have my children filled with worry, anger, concern, or pity with regard to me. None of them know yet. I do not expect them to know anytime soon.
Anyway, I appreciate your mentioning those podcasts. I am in the process of getting Fowler’s book through interlibrary loan.
I lost my testimony, if I ever had one, LONG before I discovered any tidbits of incongruent history of the church. My testimony went as a result of spiritual experiences outside the Mormon experience and I was converted immediately to a new way of seeing the world. I have been happy most of the time since. I was even happy between story telling sessions called TR interviews. I just plain have chosen to take the harder road I guess for now. It was much easier to do mental gymnastics for 2 or 3 days prior to interview so that I could be in personal integrity with whatever story I was telling myself while I answered the questions. The rest of the year I didnt think about it. I thought this would be easier being truely honest with myself and the Bishop. I accepted at the time that I may end up having to reveal myself to my children. Now I wonder how that will show up and what will happen to each of them and my relationship with them. It is all a mystery.
I need this board and the podcasts so that I can keep believing that it is possible to have personal integrity while answering in my head questions that the inquirer does not have in his head, if you know what I mean. I prefer open honesty AND I have not done that with my kids because what I have to share is NOT something duplicatable. I cannot give them my faith. I cannot provide for them the spiritual experiences I have had. I cannot move another person to be as motivated as I am to do good and love and be open to all things and all people. I like that the church occurs as duplicatable. Simple requirements, specific rewards. I did NOT get the rewards as promised and my children often do get them.
Anyway, blah blah blah. I appreciate all of you being here and caring.
