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If I truly believe it is God’s will to wear silk PJs, then sacrificing time away from my family to work in salt mines to save for that can be rewarding to me and my family based on our faith. Happiness can come to me and my family because of it. Peace and confidence and strength, all can come through a sacrifice that others may look at and laugh and scoff. If the sacrifice leads to building character and devotion, then it would seem to be pleasing to a wise God. We may find that God tells us he could care less about silk PJs, but helps us realize who we have become because of our sacrifices. Others may build character and devotion in other ways, and so there are more than one way to please God and to progress.
I think many things in the church are silk pajamas. The “thing” isn’t of substance, but how we use it may be, and therefore is not a waste to sacrifice for, because the value is where our heart is, not in the clothing.
My guess is that they are not actively trolling websites to find dissenters. But if I start stirring trouble, and there is printed words that establish my behavior as destructive to the purpose of the church, they’ll use what they can to establish grounds for dismissal. If I’m not causing trouble, I have nothing to fear on sharing my opinions.
I don’t think it is like what DA was referring to, that they aren’t open to feedback (my interpretations of DA’s words). I think it is more that some feedback is healthy, and some is just not appropriate or helpful.
I’m open to my kids giving me feedback, but I will also discipline them if they start getting disrespectful or undermining my authority. You can’t live under my roof and say and do whatever you want and I have to allow it and keep offering benefits.
Just because some individuals are treated harshly doesn’t mean the church is out to get all of us, or is big brother.
I would remind this person that we often stop thinking when we hear, “The prophet said xxx”, because we think we must just obey. But when one does keep thinking, the questions are valid:
– What did the prophet actually say? (Where is it documented)
– What was the context and when was it said?
– What was the principle being taught?
The last is obviously the most important, because we are trying to learn to be better people. Anyone who uses the crutch of “The prophet said” as the basis of their argument for being “right” or “wrong” probably doesn’t realize all the things the prophets have said over time.
It sounds like the person asking the question in the email is wanting supporting quotes and documents to go back and bash the strict son-in-law and win an argument. That won’t work.
There is no winning of arguments. There are only opinions. Some opinions matter greatly, but the principles and teachings are what Christ taught that are important, not rules about ear piercings or whatever. It is a church of love, not a church of fear. That’s my opinion.
SilentDawning wrote:But then, out comes Costa’s talk last conference stressing the whole blind obedience concept all over again. So, there is not a consistent message.
Didn’t someone say (Pres Monson maybe???) in the last conference that talks are not assigned to speakers, but they let them follow the spirit to decide for themselves, which are then obviously approved and read over? So there really can’t be a consistent message in Conference Talks, because different speakers are choosing their topics, right? Pres Monson didn’t say, “I need Elder Costa to go get some support for me.”
Anyway, it seems more like lots of well-intentioned people are trying hard to keep offering inspiring messages and best practices…which just turn into more rules. The intention is good, but the result is information overload. I need a google browser for church rules, and search on “Important to my growth” – and let the filter tell me which ones I should focus on, because I can’t focus on them all at once, which is the realization that we all live buffet style.
I don’t think the rules
HAVE TOreplace the religion. I can choose which rules I find helpful in my religion, and keep doing my best to be a better person, even if I’m not perfect keeping them all. I think this is the official teaching of the church:
Quote:The Lord’s law of marriage is monogamy unless he commands otherwise to help establish the House of Israel (see Encyclopedia of Mormonism Vol. 3, pp. 1091-1095).
Similar to the law of thou shalt not kill, unless I tell Nephi otherwise in his specific situation.
I have not ever seen any teachings that the eternities adhere to all the same commandments as the earthly commandments. For example, fasting won’t be a problem in the next life, or tithing or Word of Wisdom, I don’t think.
Sealings are a bit different, as they are done in the temples as ordinances instead of commandments, and the faith is kind of founded on the principle of the eternal family. But I really can’t figure out what it means. We’ll be sealed with our spouse and always walk/float around together holding hands? Will our kids always be next to us, and with their spouses, and their inlaws and their families and …
I guess I go with Hawkgrrrl … its more about saving the human race collectively, and I’m not sure what that means about marriage in the afterlife and relationships and being Kings and Queens and making our own worlds. I just get confused thinking of all that speculation
:crazy: I think if you asked 12 different apostles, you’d probably get differing opinions on the matter, because we don’t know. So, I guess that means I can believe what I want … and I don’t believe polygamy will be lived in the eternities. Nope…not gonna believe it.
Thats a cool story. It is interesting sometimes how much the experience can vary from ward to ward. The organization and material may be correlated, but the experiences vary as widely as personalities of individuals vary. Good for you. Here’s hoping next week is just as good!
Cool! I seem to see that the whole caffeinated soda standard has relaxed in the church, don’t you think? It just is not a big deal church-wide like it used to be. Sure there are some people holding on to this standard, but it seems more culturally acceptable nowadays, in my experience. Would you agree?
I would think 10 years ago, you wouldn’t have been given permission from the bishop on this. Do you think?
Welcome! 2 of my favorite quotes of yours…
Henry David Thoreau wrote:Before printing was discovered, a century was equal to a thousand years.
Henry David Thoreau wrote:Do not be too moral. You may cheat yourself out of much life so. Aim above morality. Be not simply good; be good for something.
Good to have you here.
Sorry, Andrew. No recommendations from me. None really struck me this time around. Just some more talks about lots of things. Nothing really jumped out at me. As a result of watching conference with my son, he asked me if I would read the scriptures daily with him (he’s 12). I thought that was a great result, and we’ve been enjoying it together.
Sometimes I think good things can happen or come into our lives, independent of the material being presented. So maybe you should just pick some sessions and read/listen … and see if anything particular strikes you. But I have no recommendations on where to start, just wherever…its pretty much the same things as last conference.
I like Ray’s point. I can see it is kind of like a divorce. It happens all the time (50% of marriages, right?) – so it can be done, but it is not easily done, and there are considerations (kids, finances, etc). So it can be done, but one must be okay with also facing the consequences of the choice.
Tom Haws wrote:For what it’s worth, in my own case I don’t feel I have left anything of worth behind or aside. Everything of worth I have kept, many things of distraction I have dropped, and a kingdom have I discovered. Keep believing. There is grounding. There is solid rock. There is safety. Only believe.
Well said, Tom. I think there are many distractions, and sometimes we feel like we must hold on to everything…like an obsessed person who can’t ever get rid of anything, and then ends up with a cluttered and messed up house.It may be time for me to clean house, and make sure I keep those things of worth, and let go of the rest.
BeLikeChrist wrote:try to remember your spiritual experiences.
Good thought! I will not go back and redefine my spiritual experiences I’ve had…those are sacred to me. But they don’t necessarily sustain me going forward. I want a new outlook on my faith to continue to have meaningful experiences along my journey, but just because I doubt things now doesn’t mean I have to go back and redefine prior experiences. I can let them be and move forward. Thanks for your comments.
SilentDawning makes a great point about how it is cultural and not uniquely Mormon. Sounds like the local congregation he came from was making it hard to break from their group. Maybe all groups do that to protect themselves? Maybe it gives them something to do so they are not idle … Because the devil will find work for idle hands, right?
BeLikeChrist, Thank you for sharing your experience. You seem at peace with yourself.
In the last conference priesthood session, which I had to go back and reread after some things bothered me when delivered, but afterwards see maybe speakers didn’t really say things the way I initially took it, Pres Monson said our society continues to slip further from the standards of the church. He said it has become more of a society of “anything goes”.
How do you find peace and let go of things in the church and still not slip into a “anything goes and therefore nothing matters” approach to life?So many great responses! What a friendly group! This is the way church should be. CanadianGirl, the things you find divine about your new place you are in, do you find them just as fulfilling, or do u think we just have to settle or compromise because it’s less stressful that way?
Tom, I like your approach. Keep learning, huh? There is plenty of truth out there to find.
