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Wayfarer posts his “ninety-five theses” on the wall of StayLDS.com.
I always love your views my friend. Glad to have you in our community.
^lol
Seriously, thank you for posting that, I am working on framing a similar statement for myself. It is tough going though. I don’t anticipate it is something I will ever be done with.
Quote:I can’t help but wonder what his reaction would be if I told him that in the future, if he wanted to be a temple worker…he would have to shave.
Indeed, or if he wanted to attend his own namesake university.
Welcome, I am a physics student as well, and I think there are useful parallels to be made with studying physics and spirituality. With experimental physics nothing is ever definitive, but the field has agreed on certain standards before something can be accepted as truth. The problem with applying similar standards to spirituality is duplicating the experimental conditions, which are to variable from person to person. However, looking at people across the world and surveying world religions has come up with many commonalities.
This is off the top of my head from my experience, so take it as an example.
There is a god, he loves people, he hears prayers and answers them. 68% (1 sigma)
There is a god 95% (2 sigma)
There is something in life greater than the individual 99.7% (3 sigma)
It can also be applied to behavior:
You should obey the 10 commandments 1 sigma
You should treat others how you want to be treated 2 sigma
You should consider the results of your actions on others 3 sigma
Because of the innate variables with the experimental conditions, you can’t expect the same certainty levels you do in physics, you have to look to other behavioral sciences for comparison (psychology etc.). Also, keep in mind that if you gave a classroom full of 6th graders a protractor and a ruler and told them to show what the cosine of 60 degrees is, you wouldn’t get a high level of certainty either.
These are good thoughts, but I’m not ready to decide what they mean to me yet. I need to write them down and revisit them later. Wolf in sheep’s clothing exactly. The terrifying part is, as far as we can tell, he has never been caught, never been charged, and is still likely a member of the church in good standing. Coming now to a ward near you. Quote:When I spend time on this site, it is dedicated to God, to a church with no walls or location — the Church of the Lamb of God.
Thank you for doing so, it helps me.
Quote:I felt at peace. At peace that things would work out and that God has a way of reconciling this complex world with your frailties
I admire that, I strive to it and think I have obtained it sometimes.
I also admire how you found good in a situation that must have been very frightening and could easily have been totally negative.
Quote:what is so hard about being bullied in an lds church setting is culturally we are taught to “endure unto the end” and we go to church come hell or high water. i lived a similar experience. i had become an object of gossip.
I am so sorry about your experience. It is such a betrayal to be treated in such a way by people who should be Christlike. I think people tend to overlook and even underestimate the experiences of people who are mistreated, often they are told outright that it is their fault, and to get over it, without any regard to the real harm that has been done.
In the case of my sister the abuse was more blatant. If the perpetrator could be found and the abuse proven and justice served (3 big IF’s) he would be imprisoned for a long time.
Yes, I consider myself worthy. To me the temple recommend questions cover two general topics: Testimony and worthiness. I’m not sure why the last question only asks about worthiness, but not testimony, because to me they are different things.
Worthiness: Am I comfortable with my obedience to the rules asked about in the TR interview? Yep.
Those questions are a pretty small proportion of all the commandments and things we are supposed to be doing, and, I occurs to me, tend to be pretty outward. They are also pretty far from the “first and great commandment”. In fact, and please correct me if I’m wrong, I don’t remember anything about love at all in the interview, nothing about serving others. You could argue that those things are encompassed under previous questions, but why didn’t they choose to put them out front?
Testimony: Do I believe in all the things they ask me to believe in? No right now.
But they don’t ask me that at the end, they only ask me to judge my worthiness, which is more outward (if you base it on the TR questions themselves), and not my testimony which is completely inward.
It seems odd to me that this is the case. It is much easier to tell if someone isn’t paying tithing, child support, wearing garments, etc. than it is to tell if they believe in God or the Restoration. (Not saying it is easy, but it is easier, at least possible)
Or is it because if I don’t have a belief, I am considered unworthy?
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My answer: “YES I am. The Lord has certainly been merciful to me as a sinner, and between him and me, I’m fine.”I think this is the most important answer, not just for a TR interview, but for anyone who believes in God and sin. What a powerful statement.
For me the answer is yes. I do think that if I am going to use the historical definition of the WoW, that I would also have to accept other historical doctrine as well.
Since I’m not cool with polygamy, blacks not having the priesthood, etc. I choose the modern definition of the WoW.
For me, my commitment to not partaking of the big 4 is separate from my feelings about the church. I become addicted to things easily. I know myself well enough to know that I would drink coffee all day, not just a cup in the morning, that I would drink a lot of alcohol, and drink it often, and smoke quite frequently. For me, it is the best choice to stay away, because I have a hard time with moderation.
Thanks for compiling all of this. After reading everything you have written, it is striking how much church culture and tradition has added to the official instructions that have been given. It reminds me of modesty standards: Growing up it was totally acceptable within the church for youth to wear tank tops and shorts above the knee. Now, at least where I live, it isn’t. Not a policy change but a cultural one.
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Were they all born to the same mother or different?2 were twins that were both stillborn, it is very likely that if the mother had access to outstanding medical care when needed, they would have survived, but although the doctors did all they could with what they had, it didn’t happen. Since then, they have had more children.
1 was to a different sister, it was especially heartbreaking because it came after years of infertility and a miscarriage. I have no idea how she had the courage to get pregnant again, but she did, and now has two more children.
For myself, after having a miscarriage I decided that I didn’t want to risk the wide range of emotions intrinsic to the process of getting pregnant and enduring a pregnancy, so I decided to be happy with the children that I have.
Quote:The concept of Zion is not of sameness – but of communal love, effort, and cooperation.
I agree, there is no one person good or talented enough to make copies of.
I love to read my great grandfather’s diary where he complains about how much harder it is to get people to come to the dances he is organizing when the bishop won’t let him serve beer. It is possible that he was inspired to talk to me after talking to someone, but that is not what he told me. He told me that he considers a conversation with the RSP to be inspiration. Fine. He can call anything he wants inspiration, that is none of my business at all. But when he has such a broad definition, it makes it harder for me to trust in his inspiration, which I am regularly asked to do.
And I have to ask myself if trusting in his inspiration is part of sustaining him, which of course is relevant to the TR question. (I would have posted this on the TR thread, but I didn’t want to hijack.)
Wow, the Ammon story is great. I love that, it illustrates a point, and made me chuckle (not loudly). Not only did it apparently take inspiration, but it took an hour. Quote:Why is the spirit so often ineffective in prompting people do to things that could save major problems.
This is why inspiration is such a big issue to me. My sister was abused regularly in a church full of people who were supposed to be able to be inspired. Why was no one ever inspired to do something as simple as walk in the room at the right time?
