Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Old-Timer wrote:
Read; play Monopoly, Rummy and Free Cell; play or listen to good music; invent new sports; learn everything there is to know; create a universe and a few billion spirits.
You know, the simple things.
Well anecdotal anyways.
If it is a mirror of how things run here, it will just be constant church, with meetings that literally last an eternity, with no breaks, because we can no longer die from starvation. Endless and eternal reams of paperwork, assignments to clean the black holes once an astronomical cycle, space scouts on Tuesdays, family cosmos evenings on Mondays, nursery assignments that last millions of years.
So, I hope it’s not like that, and not like the Duggars either. One or two kids at a time is lots.
Aside from that, as a major plot point to our existence, and the entire point of our being here, it would be nice to know what the afterlife actually entails.
According to the newsroom, all that planet stuff the missionaries talked about was bogus speculation, and from what I can tell, the universe seems to be getting along just fine creating and destroying its own stars and worlds without our help.
But also apparently Jehovah was able to create a world and rule it without the benefit of a body, so then planet making is not exclusive to resurrected and glorified beings.
Bit of a paradox there, especially if God is no respecter of persons.
At least the Greek gods had clear jobs. Making weapons, ruling the sea, fornicating with humans, or overthrowing their parent gods. We have minimal insight, other than some celestial MacGuffin anecdotes. (A MacGuffin being a motivating plot device that causes much sacrifice and strife to try to attain, with little explanation as to why it is important)
Ann wrote:The Vision says that very few people are consigned to hell. Somewhere in RSR he called it the contraction of hell. But in spite of that quote about the telestial kingdom being so great we’d kill ourselves now to get there (Am I dreaming that up? Can’t remember.), it seems like a lot of the emphasis in Plan of Salvation lessons is on how unacceptable (practically hellish) anything but the celestial kingdom is, and debating and defining what it takes to get there.
I haven’t heard anyone yet say what we are actually supposed to do once we get wherever we might go.
I think the five degrees of glory likely came about because if everyone is a King, then no one is. Kings require peasants, otherwise they have nothing to rule. It is men who desire power who construct such ideas.
Bds4206 wrote:The fact that the Angels came back for the plates that were originally buried in a hill is the part of that whole story that is maybe the most unbelievable to me. I mean, those plates sat in upstate New York for all that time and angels were concerned about others examining them? That’s very fishy to me.
Yes, I think Joseph would have been hounded endlessly if people thought he had golden plates. He had to be rid of them somehow, and those magic moments only happen when no one is around to see.
Probably a good thing the KJV is not subject to copyright laws, as that would change the opinion of the myriad of borrowed lines of text appearing throughout the BoM. Lawyers would have a field day and make lots of money. Personally I find it very unlikely that Joseph would take the time to exhaustively compare two scripts, and then choose to use secondary source material for use in the primary manuscript. It sets off my baloney meter. It seems way more work than straight translation, considering he would have to translate each word or paragraph he was comparing anyway.
Without taking the time to translate and compare, it would be very difficult to know where to start, where to stop, what to borrow, and in what order to arrange the borrowed text. Thus, I don’t buy the argument that it was somehow easier.
I think Christ was perfectly fine meeting in small groups on a hillside or at someone’s table. I don’t think the gospel requires huge church buildings and endless administration. My most fond church memories are my little branch meeting in a living room and having a lunch after.
There are several things in the temple that I personally have interpreted to be somewhat contrary to the typical Plan of Salvation taught in missionary and Sunday school lessons. For example it appears that you do not require a physical body or exhalation to exhibit Godlike powers and create a world full of life. It appears as though evil is allowed to exist in paradisiacal glory, and also that God desired Adam to sin in order to kick start phase two of the Plan, by having him succumb to the trap he no longer remembers building himself.
Trouble is, these are my interpretations. The fellow who fell asleep on my shoulder the minute the lights went out probably has a different idea of what is portrayed in the temple drama.
But, even DW has begun to question why Adam and Eve were unable to procreate on the garden, unable to find a justification that is satisfying to her interpretation.
The trouble is there is no antechamber off the celestial room with a library describing the symbolism of the forms, rituals, and practices of the temple, and rarely do two people have the same answer to the same question.
I would prefer more clarity. We have no problem defining the symbolism of baptism, the sacrament, and even the washing and anointing is done very well, but the endowment seems disjointed and incomplete. We start out with a review of the creation account, the fall of man, keeping his first estate, and then somehow it becomes an advertisement for missionaries. Then a series of forms and rituals of which only one is really discussed in any detail.
While I have found the endowment interesting, I have not found it as inspiring as the sermon on the mount.
It seems inefficient and cumbersome, but the next person in line will say it was wonderful. Good for them.
My sister in law came out as gay about two years after coming home from her mission. It was a shock to most of her family, save her eldest sister who knew she struggled with gender identity earlier on, and I suspected she was gay from the moment I met her. Her other two siblings, my wife included, were very offended/devastated at first, proclaiming she would never be allowed to speak to their children, they would never speak of her “condition”, and lamented how they couldn’t be an eternal family anymore. This sent my SIL into hiding for awhile,
I did damage control at home, and was able to get my DW to come to grips with the situation and not be so irrational, and she was able to overcome her agony in a few months, gain a better perspective, and start rebuilding her relationship.
The other antagonistic sister took about a year to calm down enough to be rational, but still suffers depression about it.
The mother-in-law probably took it the hardest, as she is very proud of her girls, and says she has accepted it, but will not talk about it outside the immediate family. It got a bit worse when SIL got engaged to be married to her girlfriend late last year, but she is still a loving mother to her.
It took some time, LDS cultural values run deep, and often trump family relationships, but in this case, the dust has mostly settled. In my case I felt it was important to be Christlike and not judgemental or condemning in any way, as some one who comes out is tired of doing it on their own and is finally asking for support. I imagine it is a painful experience when they don’t find it.
So, my advice is if you have a feeling a family member is gay, keep an open mind, and learn to deal with your own feelings before it becomes a problem, then be ready to help others.
A person who is gay is just like the rest of us, looking for love and acceptance. If two humans love and respect each other, that is enough.
Ugh, garments are the worst. Nothing but chafing, rashes, and cut off circulation, not to mention when they somehow grab on to your chest hair and rip it out while reaching for a stapler or something. I wear Under Armour under the garments when I need to do something physical for a long time, or just Under Armour when doing something physical for a short time. Works way better, no rashes, no chafing.
When I read Jesus saying: “..consider the lilies of the field..” In 3rd Nephi, with exacting language as is found in an old 1600’s English translation of a Greek text of a handed down story put to parchment long after the mortal ministry, it gives me a sinking feeling. The sermons of Jesus are too similar between the NT and the BOM. The idea that the savior would regurgitate language while teaching does not sit well with me anymore. While some may say it is the spirit that informed these stories, that they are multiple witnesses of Jesus, I cannot currently accept that Jesus would not deliver a more personalized address to the Nephites.
As a non-American I also have trouble with the the story of the Title of Liberty, which does not feel genuine to my heart. It feels as if it is grasping for some patriotic connection or common ground that I do not share, but perhaps it is just my perception.
There are other things too, but I do not wish for a knock-down drag-out fight with the BOM, as there is much in there that is profound and of good report. It has just been increasingly uncomfortable to read and accept as a whole, and that makes me very sad.
kristmace wrote:It sounds corny, but ‘what would Jesus do?’
Jesus said that we should love God and love each other. There were no conditions given on how to express that love.
Martha wrote:
Interesting tid-bit. When I was a freshman at BYU, I was called to be the assistant to the assistant ward clerk and participated in the processing and recording of weekly tithing. I’ve never heard of such a thing before or since, but I, a woman, actually touched tithing money.But a year or so ago I was released as Sunday school secretary because It was decided that the Sunday school presidency should be all male. I don’t know if the decision was a local one or church wide, but apparently the priesthood is required to pass out roles and ring the bell.
:crazy: Yeah, it’s like the gymnastics the local Bishopric tells the deacons to do if there is a gap in the pew while passing the sacrament, to avoid at all costs having a girl or woman walking with the tray from one end of the gap to the other.
Ridiculous.
Martha wrote:I agree Ray. We as members need to get out more with our neighbors offering unconditional service and work on breaking down the us and them boundary.
But not in a “Children of the Corn” kind of way.
Hi there! I noticed you drive to work quite early, so I was sitting in your car making sure you had a nice warm seat!
Old-Timer wrote:That’s not true, Reflexzero. I’ve known some women who could enter a contest if they wanted to do so.
:silent: LOL yep. I am reminded of an anecdote of a male temple worker who wondered why some of the sisters didn’t have to shave their moustaches too.
