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Joni wrote:

1. Do you think Heavenly Mother(s) participated in the creation of the earth?

2. If yes, how do you reconcile that with the fact that the creation is depicted in the temple as being an all male endeavor?

1. I think the creation story is probably just a story, like the creation stories of many other cultural traditions. The actual literal Creation could’ve happened in countless ways. As a kid, in the Church, my mom and various Primary teachers taught me that Heavenly Mother did help create the earth, so I always accepted it as a given even though it isn’t in the official story.

2. I think the creation is depicted in the temple as an all-male endeavor because our culture for many centuries has been patriarchal, and that’s the lens through which we’ve traditionally viewed everything. The scriptures are mostly full of stories about men with I’d say <10% of the material being about women. It doesn't mean women weren't around or that they weren't doing anything important. It just means there's a longstanding tradition of not bothering to mention them when they do important stuff. Kinda like the "King James" translation of the Bible wasn't exactly King James sitting there at a desk, translating away; it was a whole bunch of dudes working together on the translation, and then presenting it to the King and slapping his name on it. I assume the king commissioned it. Maybe Heavenly Father commissioned Heavenly Mother to make a world. Maybe she did all the work. Maybe it was totally fun and she was happy to do it by herself. Maybe she's miffed about not getting credited. Maybe she doesn't even care whether she gets credit or not; she's busy making even cooler worlds, now.

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DarkJedi, thank you. That’s a great analysis of the “doubt your doubts” bit. I agree – like most quotations, it’s best interpreted in context. I also agree with peteolcott in that thread that that counsel encourages bias, and with Roy that bias isn’t necessarily always best avoided, or even always possible to avoid. It’s really exciting to find other members of the church who overtly acknowledge the presence of bias, but in a positive light.

Roy wrote:

Taken in context it could have said something like “Go slow and don’t rush to permanent judgments” or “Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater.”

Yes. I’m fully on board with that interpretation. I wish Elder Uchtdorf could’ve said that, instead of “first doubt your doubts”!

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This forum is the best EVER! What amazing people! Thank you, all of you who took the time to reply. I appreciate it a lot.

It sounds hard to be fully active knowing that I can’t fully express where I’m at in terms of belief. But I think you guys are right that to be completely open would generally be unwise. I get a panicky feeling when I think about returning to full activity – it’s really wigging me out. But it also saddens me deeply to entertain the alternatives. I really miss it.

Oddly, supporting my family in their activity won’t be necessary. My husband and I met at BYU. My husband had served a full mission in Taiwan. I’d been active my whole life. I never thought we’d one day become “inactive.” We moved into our current ward a few years ago and just decided we wouldn’t attend anymore. It was pretty abrupt. My husband has completely lost his testimony, and my 12- and 10-year-old kids are pretty indifferent. My in-laws are active, and my father is active, but my mom and both of my brothers have gone inactive over the past decade. So going back will probably be uncomfortable in some ways, because I’ll likely be there not as part of a TBM family, but just as plain old me, not fitting into the mould or even appearing to do so. My husband doesn’t have the same sense of loss that I do since we “went inactive.” He is totally fine cutting himself off from everything church-related. He is also totally fine whether or not I choose to go to church. But he has no desire to go.

SilentDawning, I appreciate the reminder to make happiness the goal, and to accept who I am.

SilentDawning wrote:

The rules that invoke miracles are so murky, it causes me as much turmoil as it does peace to try to use prayer as a means of bettering my life in significant ways.

This! I sometimes find it necessary to go for periods of time without making any requests, but focus solely on what I’m grateful for, simply because I felt like continually exercising the faith involved in praying for blessings that never seemed to come was really messing me up big time.

LookingHard wrote:

…there is only you and God you need to be concerned with.

LookingHard,

I believe this is true, and sometimes wish that bishopric and stake presidency interviews for temple recommends, etc., were not done, because it puts an intermediary between the individual and God. Eastern Orthodoxy seems to put a lot of focus on the individual’s relationship with God being a personal one, and not anyone else’s business; I like that.

Heber13 wrote:

Focus on orthopraxy, and stay engaged to do good things.

Heber13, thank you. I had to google “orthopraxy”!

DarkJedi wrote:

When I do pray I express my love for my family, my admiration for the beauty of the earth, and other such very vague things that I could really say to pretty much any man on the street. I don’t ask for anything.

DarkJedi, thanks, I very much relate to that. Sometimes that is the only way I stay sane, with regards to prayer. I sense something valuable in the simple ritual of performing the act itself, but I feel less…manipulated…if I can do it while maintaining somewhat of a distance.

That Elder Uchtdorf talk is beautiful. I don’t quite understand the advice to “doubt your doubts before you doubt your faith.” But the rest of it is so encouraging. Makes me want to keep trying. My kids are 12, 10, and 14-months. (Yes, we have a giant age gap between kids 2 and 3. Yes, #3 was conceived purposefully. Everyone asks.) Thanks, too, for the link to the threat about sheep and llamas. The Bednar Napoleon Dynamite gif alone made my day.

Roy, yes, that discrepancy between the expectation that the Church’s teachings gave me and what ACTUALLY happened…that is the problem!

Orson, thank you for sharing your experience. I would love to have a profound experience like that. I guess I’ve had a hard time letting go of one thing: the expectation that an individual’s faith should be able to influence actual events. That’s a notion of which I can’t quite let go, because I still think it might be true; I only know it doesn’t operate according to the rule book that I was told was applicable.

I sure am glad to have found all of you on this forum. Thank you for being here and letting me know things are okay.

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